Sid: Hello. Sid Roth here. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. My guest, Mike Shreve, is an expert on an area called New Age. Most people aren’t familiar with what the New Age is. As a matter of fact, many people that call themselves Bible believers, have a mixture. They have a little new age and a little true supernatural of God. So I asked Mike to explain what the counterfeit looks like and keep in mind you can’t have a good counterfeit unless it’s a counterfeit of something authentic. The authentic is the supernatural of God as defined in the Bible. The counterfeit looks like it, smells like it, tastes like it, but it really isn’t. Mike, what is exactly included in this term “new age”?
Mike: Well it’s a very comprehensive term, Sid, that can swing all the way to the left and embrace dark spirituality like Wicca and witchcraft, and then it can swing all the way to the right and embrace groups like mind science groups and positive thinking courses, and quite a few other groups in the middle.
Sid: Now you wouldn’t think that swinging all the way to the right, as you put it, that positive thinking would be under that, but it really is.
Mike: Well there are certain new age principles…
Mike: … they adhere to that unite them altogether under this banner. Almost all new age type groups believe in a coming new age of heightened spiritual awareness in the world that differ in how they think that’s going to pass. But it’s all based on astrology because actually the term “new age” stems from astrology, the idea that the sun passes through 12 houses as it goes around the earth, which is of course, opposite to the truth.
Sid: That’s why I said, it’s a good counterfeit.
Mike: But the new age is called the Aquarian age. And according to astrology, we are now in the Piscean age, which is an age of knowledge and reason and that we’re at the juncture where we’re passing into the Aquarian age, which is supposed to be an age of spirituality and God-consciousness in the world, where many of the world’s problems are solved. So it’s a very optimistic view of the future and it’s all tied in with an awakening in spirituality.
Sid: Now you said it covers so many different areas. But yet, there are certain things in common. What else does it all have in common?
Mike: New-agers usually embrace some of these beliefs. For instance, number one, they believe in the need for spirituality instead of religion. Most of them are burned out on religion.
Sid: Does that sound familiar?
Mike: But this is where the error comes in. They believe that all religions and all paths of spirituality are legitimate means to achieve the “in”, which is ultimate reality. Most new-agers are looking for an experience of ultimate reality. And number three, they believe that there are means or devices they can implement in order to achieve an experience of ultimate reality, like meditation or yoga or things like that. Then most new-agers also believe that, as I mentioned, there is a coming age of enlightenment, and the way we’re going to move into that new age is by individuals awakening their own divine nature. Now there’s a very key element. Most new-agers believe that we are God, that we are expressions of the Divine, and the key to bringing this planet to peace is realizing our own Godhood, if you would. And that’s the antithesis of the truth, we’ll never be God and we can awaken a God nature within. But that’s one of the basic teachings.
Sid: Well you know, the reason that Mike is so well knowledgeable, because, number one, he studied for many years, but before he knew the Messiah, he actually taught yoga at four universities in the Tampa, Florida area. Why did you even get into yoga? What was your goal?
Mike: When I was a freshman in college, I had a near-death experience because of drugs. I went into an overdose experience where I felt, I believe it was actually happening, my soul leaving my body, the life gathering from my hands and feet to the center of my chest, going out into this void that was quite frightening. And I realized then that I was throwing my life away and I needed to find something of eternal value. So I dropped out of college to study under an Indian guru and I became very devoted to a group called Kundalini Yoga, under a man named Yogi Bhajan. And I was spending from 3:30 in the morning to 5:30 at night in some kind of discipline doing Hatha Yoga, Raji Yoga, meditating, chanting, mantras, reading various scriptures.
Sid: You were really dedicated.
Mike: I was into it passionately for a long period of time.
Sid: If Bible believers were just as dedicated. And Mike, you were successful. There was a full-page article about you in a Tampa newspaper.
Mike: And I thought that would increase my classes. I was teaching at four universities.
Sid: About how many students?
Mike: I had about two to 300 students in four universities in the Tampa area. And this big article came out in the Tribune and I thought for certain my classes would go from 200 to maybe 900 or a thousand. Instead..
Sid: But wait a second? Were you materialistic? Did you want to make money? What was your goal?
Mike: No. In fact, I never charged for my classes. I just put a little basket in the back of the class and if they wanted to drop something in they did. I lived a very separated life. I was somewhat of a recluse and I didn’t know anything materially. So that was my focus. But I wanted to impact the world. I thought that what was teaching would help people bring their lives to a place of peace and a place where they could achieve God-consciousness and become more whole individuals.
Sid: But unbeknownst to Mike, what he thought the purpose of this full-page article was not the purpose at all.
Sid: A group of born-again Christians read the article and decided they wanted to make a focus of their prayer, Mike Shreve. And did they pray a lot for you?
Mike: Every hour.
Sid: Every hour?
Mike: They assigned somebody to do fasting and praying over me every hour of everyday.
Sid: You didn’t stand a chance.
Mike: No. For a month, I was soaked with intercession.
Sid: Okay. So you decide you’re going to check the Bible out, check Jesus out and you say, I’m going to take one day.
Mike: Just one day
Sid: Tell me about that day.
Mike: Well what happened is during that month-long period I got a letter from an old friend and he told me how he had been born-again, which was a foreign term to me. I didn’t understand, but he described Jesus coming into his heart and how he finally had an encounter with God. I wrote him back and said, “That doesn’t make sense to me.” But the letter just weighed on my mind until one day, as you said, I decided, you know, I’ve got to be open-minded. So I dedicated that whole day to the Lord Jesus and I said I’m not going to do yoga. I’m not going to chant. I’m not going to do any meditation like I’m normally involved in. I’m just going to pray and read the Bible today. And if you really are the Messiah and if you really did come to die on a cross for the sense of humanity, then I believe you’ll show me today.
Sid: Alright. Hold that thought. I know you’re going anywhere. We’ll be back right after this word.
Sid: Now, my guest Dennis Walker has caught something from God that every believer on earth can walk in. That every believer on earth must walk in, as a matter of fact, “Dennis has the Lord shown you that we’re coming close to that point where there will be so many miracles and such a revival I have to believe that we are getting close to that point?”
Dennis: I believe that as well, I see things happening that just confirm that as things get darker, people of God have to shine like bright lights.
Sid: You know, I was reminded on yesterdays broadcast of a, I read the life story of Pat Robertson, and it was called “Shout it From the Rooftops.” And one day God spoke to Pat and said that through a scripture, “Sell everything that you have.” So his wife was out of town, so he sells all the furniture in his apartment, but he doesn’t tell his wife and so she comes home to an empty apartment. “Where is my furniture? Where’s my bed?” You know can you image the argument that he had. “Well, what happened when your wife came home because God told you to put a tent in your house, what did she think?”
Dennis: Well, my wife ask the question “Den, doesn’t that go up outside?” And I told her…
Sid: That’s an understatement. Ha-ha
Dennis: I said, “No, this is going to be in the house and me in it. Ha ha.
Sid: Ah ha and “What did she say?” Ha-ha
Dennis: Well, my wife is very gracious, she is probably the most gracious person on earth and she said, “Honey, pup, whatever it takes.” Ha-ha.
Sid: Okay, so was this in the living room or?
Dennis: Yes, it was in our living room.
Sid: I see and so what did you do with this tent in the living room?
Dennis: Well, the Lord had spoken to me that I would meet with Him in the tent and that He would restore to me the Feast of Tabernacles and so I got in the tent.
Sid: Wait a second, what did that mean to you at that time, He’d restore the Feast of Tabernacle?
Dennis: What I knew about the Feasts was that all of the Feasts of Israel were pictures of things coming in the future. The Feast of Passover was given to Israel to be a picture of something that would happen in the future, so that when it happened they would recognize it. And this was what happened when Jesus became our Passover Lamb. His blood was shed to bring us into right standing and access back into the very presence of God. And then there’s other feasts that we are all pictures of things to come. The Feast of Pentecost, to picture something coming. The Feast of Tabernacles is also a picture of an event coming where we learn to dwell and abide with God. So that’s what that meant to me, I was waiting for this, God is going to teach us how to live with Him.
Sid: Okay, so just out of curiosity from the day God told you to have the tent how long did it take for you to have an appointment with God?
Dennis: Oh, it happened the very same night I set up the tent, I climbed in. I got quiet; I put on headphones with instrumental music just to filter out any distraction and suddenly as I set my mind on things above, just as it says in Colossians Chapter 3 verses 1 & 2. And the Bible actually teaches you seek Heaven and it tells you how; set your mind on things above. So I simply did that, I got into the tent set my mind on things above and suddenly I’m caught into an awareness of things happening in Heaven.
Sid: Well, tell me the first thing that God told you when He spoke with you in that tent.
Dennis: The first thing He did was that He sat down with me and began to unpack the whole story of Nicodemus coming to Jesus in the middle of the night.
Sid: Now, when you say that He sat down with you, did you…was this something you could see with your eyes, was this something you sensed, or was this something that you were hearing, what do you mean?
Dennis: I was seeing this with my eyes, now I’m in my tent, I have all the awareness that my body is still in this tent, but in my spirit I was in heavenly places sitting with Jesus as He began to talk to me. And then He talked to me about this story of Nicodemus.
Sid: Why Nicodemus?
Dennis: Well, there is so much more of that story than what we’ve known, it’s all about seeing and hearing in the Heaven. Jesus told Nicodemus that you can’t see into Heaven unless you are born again, that you are born of the Spirit. And then He said you can’t enter Heaven unless you are born of water and the Spirit. And so it is all about seeing and entering into Heaven. And then He began to unfold that even more, telling us that the wind blows no one knows where it comes from and no one knows where it goes. So is everyone that is born of the Spirit and then I began to understand that God’s plan for us was to know Heaven. That Jesus died on the cross and His blood was shed to give us access to the very presence of God. That some way or another He wanted us to live out of the very resources of Heaven and not just the resources of earth. And so He began to show me; eyes would open your ability to know, taste touch and smell would open your spiritual senses would be activated to have experiences into Heaven.
Sid: Well, you not only had experiences into Heaven, you not only had Jesus teach you from the scriptures and really restore the true meaning of the Feast of Tabernacles, but your wife says when these things would occur and you would come out of the tent you would really be a changed person. What did she observe?
Dennis: You know, she actually said that do me. She said, “You know I love it when you spend time in the tent.” I was curious well why, why do you like it because I’m in there hours and hours and she said, “When you come out of that tent, you come out tender.” And that was different; I was not necessarily a tender person that wasn’t my natural state. But God was changing my character as I spent time with Him in that place.
Sid: And now, just out of curiosity, “Did your wife ever go into that tent? I mean I would have gone into it.
Dennis: Yeah, absolutely, in fact I still had two of my kids living at home when I was starting this whole thing and I had after awhile they started seeing a change in their Dad, change in the husband and they all started spending time in the tent and they all got activated into these kind of things. I mean I have prophetic children; I have a prophetic wife, because God has really poured His Spirit into them and they see beyond just the natural things.
Sid: And this is what you are teaching…
Dennis: That’s right…, simple simple simple, simple things in fact I have people read the book, I have had people that have heard me speak on these things and they have said, you know this is so simple; I have missed it because of the simplicity.
Sid: Well, you know doesn’t Jesus say that unless you become like a little child. Now, how could a child understand something complex?
Dennis: Exactly, oh man, I tell you. And He wants everyone to be able to this and not just really smart people.
Sid: Take one person that has either read your book, heard the CD or been in a seminar with you and tell me what happened to them.
Dennis: Okay, I’ve got a bunch of stories; I am going to try to pick one that is a shorter story. How about this one, a lady who began to hear our teachings and came to be part of our training center here in Los Vegas and she had been a member of the church for many years and never really had done anything. She sang in the choir, but never seen anybody born again, never seen miracles and she began to take the things that we tell people. She began to share Jesus with people, coworkers and things around her and all of a sudden that got her a lot of opposition amongst some of the workers that she was with and one day she is crying out to the Lord. Lord they are so mean to me how long will I have to put up with this? And the Lord told her that this one lady that was like the ring leader he was going to take out of the way. And so she went to work and the lady was gone and she didn’t know where she was. Turns out the lady had come down with a very very aggressive cancer and so this lady began to cry out. God give me this woman’s life, I want to see her born again, I want to see her healed. God spoke to her by initiative of Heaven the very things that we had taught. And said go to the hospital and I’ll use you to heal her. And this woman got healed, got saved in the hospital. Went back to the casino and told all of the employees in the casino this woman healed me and now she can’t go in and out of work without people asking for prayer, people asking for help.
Sid: Now, you have an apostolic resource center right there in Las Vegas. What is your…your vision of course is to equip people to go to the four corners of the earth but what’s your vision for Las Vegas, I’m curious.
Dennis: Oh yes, there is a great plan of God for our city. You know I have traveled literally in the jungles on the rivers Africa, South America, Asia and everywhere I have ever gone everybody know about Las Vegas. Everybody knows what Las Vegas is, it has…
Sid: Sure it’s synonym is the sin city.
Dennis: That’s right, all over the world that’s what they call it. I believe God has a plan in these last days to take this city and bring it to such a place where the by word around the world is “Have you heard what is happening in Las Vegas?”
Sid: Well, I want the by word to be in the house of those that are listening “Have you heard what’s happening to that family in that house…”
Sid: My guest Dr. Renny McLean and all I have to say Renny, is what are you hearing?
Renny: I just as you just did that introduction alone Sid, I just saw a miracle happen in the Spirit. I saw somebody in a hospital and I saw somebody in the hospital and I saw them on life support. This day is going to be marked by an incredible miracle. I see, I see unusual miracles taking place today in this broadcast. I see somebody on life support coming out, coming off that bed I see it, I see it, I see it, I see it, I hear faith of life today, faith alive and faith unlimited. Oh yes Sir.
Sid: Renny, tell me about the person that had and this is almost unbelievable accept I know its normal, tell me about the person that had a prosthetic leg and it materialized into a real leg.
Renny: Well, this was, this was three years ago in Miami. I was ministering in a small Pentecostal church and we had three weeks of signs wonders and miracles. No two weeks of it and I was ready to go after two weeks you know. And I was driving down to get my last drive to the beach and so on my way down there, the pastor calls me and says “Dr. Renny you can’t leave yet,’ I said, “Well, why?” “You never heard what happened?” I said, “No.” And let me just bring you up to speed with that. The reason I said, I didn’t know was when we closed the night before I didn’t pray for the sick. The last thing that I remember saying from the platform was this. I mean the worship was high, it was really wonderful and I made this statement and this is what I said. I’m telling you people are going to have to hear this real slowly. I said, “The only part of your mind that works with your faith is your imagination, because there is no law there.”
Sid: Oh that is powerful.
Renny: And I said, “You never see miracles in the terms of reasons, because reason by nature denies miracles. So I said, “You are going to have to lose reason to step into your imagination, cause in your imagination there’s no wall, but in your reason there is.” And I made that statement and I walked off the platform. And Sid a woman was in the midst, an Hispanic lady, sat there in the meeting and she was worshipping the Lord, worshipping the Lord, you know didn’t feel nothing better or nothing different but she was just worshipping the Lord. And nobody knew the woman; she went home and after she went home this is what happened. She went home that night and just worshipping the Lord, worshipping the Lord and she went to bed you know the way that she would normally go to bed and she woke up in the morning and she felt her leg it was no longer hard and she and she felt flesh. Now don’t ask me to explain, that happened. Ha-ha.
Sid: I’ll tell you something, we’re coming into that time where what you’re describing is going to be normal.
Renny: Now, I have to admit Sid now, I have seen all kinds of things teeth growing, gold teeth, that is old to me, that’s not even a miracle I think that’s good and wonderful but I tell you the honest truth Sid, did you hear me say that that shocked me cause I had never seen a whole limb before. I’d never seen a whole limb before and because of that miracle it kept us there another week. Now I’m going to be honest with you now, that I believe when we see certain miracles that’s far and few between I believe that the foretaste of the greater realm that’s coming.
Sid: And what do you see by the Spirit happening in 2011.
Renny: I see a turn coming to God’s people, I see a turn I see a turn; I see access being granted to realms that we had not walked in before and it’s going to be sovereign. People of God, for some people it’s literally just going to be where God just sovereignty does it. It is just going to just; God is going to just sovereignly do it. But there is coming a turnaround for God’s people. There’s a real turn around for God’s people. I really believe that, there is a Spirit of His grace, oh thank you Father, there is the Spirit of His grace being poured out on His people right now in that we are not coming out of the recession, now I’m speaking this to the people of God.
Sid: Right, the United States may not come out of it but we’re coming out of it; is that what you’re saying?
Renny: We are coming out of it Sid and I’ll tell you why we are coming out of it because God’s raised you up and that’s why I’ve got to speak a little bit about you Sid. Sid, God has raised you up and you’re significance is more prophetic than you realize; and I tell you why I say this. Because being that you are Jewish and I’m Jewish the Jews of God the children of Israel understand covenant. They rejected the kingdom but they know covenant, they have kept covenant. Isn’t that interesting? The church understands kingdom but don’t know covenant. And what we’re seeing is that when we, that’s why you say that the Lord’s raised you up to bring the One New Man together?
Renny: When that hits in the church and it fully explodes I believe the prosperity that the church should have, that what Israel has, I believe the church will have. So we’re living in…
Sid: That reminds me since its Passover week what did the Jewish people leave with when they left the slaves from Egypt. It made no sense at all, but they left with the wealth of the Kingdom.
Renny: Oh, my God, but Sid it goes back to that prophetic time, the portal was open, see what I’m trying to say. I’m telling you, this thing is real, if we could get your partners Sid to give special gifts during this time frame when that portal is opened. Do you have any idea what God is going to do for them?
Sid: If the portal is open, nothing is impossible.
Renny: Nothing is impossible but my God…
Sid: I mean, you’re able when the portal is open with the glory you can speak into it and it comes in the natural realm.
Renny: Oh totally, it comes in the natural realm, so God is looking for His people to show up at these appointment to meet him, meet him there, meet Him there, I mean my God, there is so many things that is tied to this. I really believe it. I mean it, this is resurrection this is Passover, oh we got to really understand.
Sid: But it’s also Resurrection too.
Renny: Yeah, it’s also Resurrection too and so God’s people have got to understand it’s a time of blessing. It’s a time of miracles, but it’s a time of blessing. It is a time of prosperity for us to deny the prosperity we are denying the former…we’re denying the reign of God. We got to come away with, we understand the covenants of the blessing and that’s what I’m saying Sid, I’m saying that it is so significant right now what God’s having you to do, it’s so significant, because right now the earth is in recession but God’s not in recession. I keep saying it His Name is El Shaddai; not El Poor O. When we understand that and Heaven and God’s not broke and He’s not I’ll file bankruptcy, oh the best is yet to come, but the portal is open. And the people of God need to step out by faith today and receive the blessing of God. Oh my God, my goodness, could you image that Sid, I know that you can see this because I know you are a prophetic man. Can you imagine when the portal is open on its own accord but it’s looking for a gift. Oh my God, oh my God, that speaks to the rest of the year for you. Oh my God, and that was part of the former reign and imagine dispensationally we’re the latter reign and if Israel left with wealth of Egypt under the former then what’s the latter reign going to be when the church understands the Glory of the Latter house?
Sid: Real quick because I’m interested tell me the most unusual story of what happened to you when you were translated.
Renny: Okay, the most unusual story was when I was asked to go to Africa, I was asked to go to Africa by my mother in the Lord by one of my mothers in the Lord, her name was CM Muirer she is dead now, this is when I was a young man by twenty-two years of age and she said to me “Renny I want you to come with me to Kenya with me” and I really wanted to go, but not at that time because we just had our first child. And so now this is what happened, she said, I said “If I get a sign from the Lord Momma, well I’ll go.” And so I went to bed that night and in the middle of my sleep I was sleeping and then I came out of sleep so to speak and I was speaking in a not an unknown tongue, and I knew if it was not an unknown because I know of the difference between an unknown and a known tongue and I was speaking in fluent Swahili and while I was speaking Swahili I remember being in places and I saw people before me and I saw myself with an interpreter next to me and I would start in English, but end up in Swahili and the interpreter would step aside. And I saw myself praying for the people and they were healed. Well, you know I could remember the places because you know; it is just prophetic I could remember as if it were yesterday. Well, the joke of it is when I went there six weeks later what would have been the 10th of March 1986 when I got there and they took me to places they said oh, Brother McLean, I said yes, the Lord bless you what are you doing here again. I said, what do you mean? You know and they said, oh you were here several weeks ago and that was almost six out of ten places I went or had that testimony of me.
Sid: You know, recently I had that same thing happen to me, has this happened many times to you Renny?
Renny: It’s happened two or three times to me and I’m expecting it to happen even more.
Sid: Yeah, things are speeding up…
Sid: My guest Gary Keesee has put together supernatural principles and how to apply them. It’s such a simplistic how to book, in fact Joyce Meyer says about it, “I believe the practical every day insight that Gary shares will educate and empower you to take control of your finances and discover the peace and financial freedom God desires for you.” So Gary, you can be supernatural and practical at the same time as long as you’re practical from a kingdom mentality verses a world mentality.
Gary: Exactly, you know we do live here, we are citizens of Heaven and the kingdom is in us, but we do live in the earth realm. So it’s vital that we understand both because any solution will involve operating within the laws that govern this realm as well as the laws that govern the kingdom of God. Especially when it comes to money, because God doesn’t have money every piece of money that you pick up today will have an earthly kingdom stamped on it. God can’t counterfeit it and He can’t steal it from someone, so we have to understand how money flows to the believer’s life in the earth realm.
Sid: And most people think that though pray and someone will knock on their door and leave a million dollars sitting there. That’s they’re understanding of the kingdom.
Gary: That is pretty much, well it’s actually kind of the perception that’s taught I think. I think people that…the church has done a great job teaching to give but I do think a lot of people give legally. You know, God will be mad if they don’t or they have the wrong perception of how money comes like you said. They think that it’s going to come, I call it mail box mentality and you and I both know a lot of people in the church world that have been waiting for a long time that have that mentality and they’re in the same financial place they were twenty years ago because they don’t understand how the kingdom operates and how money actually flows in the earth realm to the believer.
Sid: When the supernatural takes part; in fact you make this statement talking about the supernatural, giving opens the door legally for God to give you direction. What do you mean by that?
Gary: Well, this goes back to Genesis of course when Adam lost his legal dominion. You know in Luke Chapter 4, Satan tempting Jesus and he said if you will bow down and worship me I’ll give you all the glory, the splendor, and the authority of the kingdoms of the earth for they have been given to me. So Adam had that dominion, Hebrews Chapter 2, he gave it away. Satan, as Paul says in 1 Corinthians, is now the prince of the power of the air, the god of this world. Satan became the legal dominion if you will over the min (this area) and so Satan claims the wealth of the world is his. He claims that it is his, God can’t interfere with that, but what happens is when we give it changes kingdoms. Essentially what happens is that the only place of God’s government has legality in the earth realm is in us and what we bring under the dominion of the kingdom of God. One great example is Peter, James and John’s fishing story in Luke Chapter 5. Fished all night, caught nothing, worked all night professional fisherman, then Jesus comes along and borrow their boats, comes back in and then tells them to fish the deep water and they catch so many fish that the nets about break, the boats about sink and of course as a spiritual scientist I want to know what happened because I could sure use a boat load of fish you know, essentially provision. Well, if you follow the story, when they gave Jesus the boats the business changed governments. When they voluntarily gave it to Jesus, they didn’t know that this was happening, it actually changed governments which gave God the legality then to give a word of knowledge into the earth realm and tell and Jesus said the at the fish were over there in the deep water and they caught so many fish that they couldn’t contain them. When we give money, when we operate in the earth realm with God’s kingdom as 2nd Corinthians says, God gives seed to the sower. Of course we could say whose seed is it, it’s God He’s providing it and as we sow it it changes governments and it essentially God can multiply it back to us. But a lot of people don’t understand this changing of governments or the dominion of the kingdom of God. And when our place Sid, illustrates this in the story of Potipher, you know Potipher put Joseph in charge of his stuff and the Bible says the blessing of the Lord came on everything Potipher had both in the field and his home and with Joseph in charge he didn’t have to worry about anything. So they could ask, how did the blessing of God come on this Egyptian man that didn’t even know God? Because it says in Genesis 39 verse 5 that one day he put Joseph in charge. Well, what he didn’t know was when he put Joseph in charge his stuff, his things changed governments. They came under the government, the dominion of God and then the blessing of God came on his stuff and of course that refers there to Proverbs chapter 10 verse 22, “The blessing , the covenant of God brings wealth adds no sorrow with it.” And of course, that sorrow is referring to the earth curse system where Adam was left having to run, sweat and toil after everything he had in life. So there’s a kingdom that functions and when we give we can go through a lot of stories in the Bible, but people say, oh that pastor of that church just wants my money. Well, that’s not true, see what’s actually happening is God is encouraging us to participate with his government in the earth realm. And as we participate, as we give in faith with his government in mind his kingdom purposes, that gives God the legality to then move in and help us proper by identifying a word of knowledge, that could be business idea..
Sid: And, by the way let me just let me interject something here because the thought that’s coming to me is so many people have heard terminology of “plant your seed, give me a thousand dollars and you’re going” it’s almost like a heavenly slot machine, heavenly lottery there’s truth in there but there’s something wrong.
Gary: Yes, your right there is something wrong with that and I despise that kind of misunderstanding. And this portrayal of how the kingdom of God operates and so many people have become disillusioned and frustrated over what they are left to believe is that God did not do His part. When actually, you know if an airplane didn’t take off because it wasn’t moving we would know now because in the law of lift that we have to have some speed to get it moving. Because we understand the laws and when people don’t understand the laws of the kingdom they just blame God. Listen, God’s kingdom works every time.
Sid: And do you know what excites me so much, Gary is when you take up offerings after you have taught how the kingdom operates, not just for people to give you money but so that they can multiply their money so that not only can they take care of their needs but expand the kingdom, help widows and orphans and evangelistic operations. Tell me about the offerings you take up where people see a blue haze?
Gary: Well, this surprised me Sid, when God began to teach me things I had never heard any of this before and this was back in the days when we are desperate and we were asking God for solutions. And He began to teach me these principals and show me how they operated. Well, I didn’t tell anyone this stuff and we weren’t pasturing at the time, over the years we got out of debt and those stories are amazing of what happened to us. But I didn’t really go out and tell people these things, I just kept a journal, I had learned these things and then many years later, fifteen years or so after we had developed the understanding we had. He said, “I want you to begin to teach people these things.” We had of course businesses that taught some of these principals but never ministry and we began to go out and tell people how the kingdom operated and specially how giving should be done and how the kingdom works through our giving and how money flows to the believer. The first time I had a meeting where I had taught this I was taken off guard because when we took the offering up this had been after five days of teaching in Albania where people were very impoverish, they had no hope. There answer was to go to Greece, leave the country, find jobs somewhere else. But I taught these principals there for five days and the fifth day they took up an offering. The anointing came in that place in amazing way, people were dancing, and shouting and like you said a blue haze came in that place. I mean it wasn’t kind of the anointing that you may feel when you are praying or that you are preaching or teaching but it was like the very throne room of God. This blue haze came there and we just…
Sid: Not only did Gary see it but when this happens others see it. Just briefly, what happens to some of these people, what were some of the reports that you heard.
Gary: Well they began to create businesses, they understood what happened, the kingdom in them could produce their future, they didn’t have to run to other countries.
Sid: Whoops were out of time.
Sid: My guest is red hot for the Messiah, and as I’ve been explaining for the last couple of days that I have been mentoring you all of these years in the best of the best to grow in the supernatural so you can really fulfill your destiny in the end times. But if you don’t understand an end time Bible prophecy, I don’t care how much power you walk in you are going to miss it. And you understand end time Bible prophecy and you don’t walk in the power of God you won’t fulfill your full destiny. You’ll miss you full destiny and that’s why I have Walid Shoebat on the telephone. Because Walid was born in Bethlehem and Walid was trained to be a Muslim terrorist. And because of the truth in the Bible when compared with the Koran he had to choose Jesus, because truth was more important to him than family or anything this world had to offer. And he has had debates with Christians on the end times because his paradigm is so different than what we’ve been taught here in America over the last thirty some years. Now when you have your debates Walid what…how do they usually end up?
Walid: Well, they usually end up with the open heart Christian coming to our paradigm.
Sid: Now for those that aren’t familiar with what you’re are teaching and of course I’ve got your 500 page and your four DVDs on the subject. Would you briefly explain what is the usual traditional paradigm? And what is yours and the difference between the two.
Walid: Well, the traditional paradigm says that the Anti-Christ will be some homosexual, who’d be an atheist who will come from thru the European Union and the Catholic Church is the harlot of Babylon. It is a western view that is a modern view, by the way. My paradigm is saving that if we look at the literal references in the Bible of the nations that God deals with including the nations that Christ deals with, they are all Islamic. Then my paradigm looks at the issue of the Roman Empire because, North Africa is part of the Roman Empire and Turkey is part of Roman Empire. By the way both of which is mentioned in the Bible in which Christ deal with on the day of the Lord; which tells us that Islam is involved in the unfolding of the end times. So this is why I wrote “God’s War on Terror,” it’s probably the most extensive research done in history on the issue of the Bible when it come to eschatology and Islamic Eschatology which basically matches when the Anti-Christ is mentioned in the Bible.
Sid: I was just going to ask you about that because it is so specific. I’m going to tell you something, when people read your book and when they watch these DVD’s there won’t be fussiness about the end times; and they definitely won’t have the wrong paradigm. It’s the whole Bible is going to be opened up to them once they have these keys. So tell me about the comparison between the Christian Anti-Christ and the Moslem messiah; they seem to match from your book.
Walid: They match perfectly; if you look into the Anti-Christ of the Bible in Daniel it tells us he will basically confirm a covenant for seven years. In Islam the Mahadee will confirm a covenant for seven years as well. In the Bible it tells us he is Lucifer the Anti-Christ will be Lucifer embodying a man. Mohammed, the prophet of Muslim clearly says that the Mahadee will have the most beautiful of all angels in him. In fact in the Arabic language the Hadee is very clear.——- Mahadee is the most beautiful of all angels, upon him is the cloaks of light. When we look at where he settles in Islam he settles on the Temple Mount. He makes a covenant with one of the children of our own; actually what the Bible says the Anti-Christ will enter into the temple and he will make a covenant with Israel. So it’s pretty clear both the Anti-Christ and the Mahadee will deny the Trinity.
Sid: You know as I read your book I see that Muslims are being led to the slaughter so to speak by their own religion.
Walid: Absolutely. They are led to believe to deny the Trinity, to deny the crucifixion, to deny the Deity of Jesus Christ, which matches perfectly with…
Sid: But wait a second, I have a friend that tells me he has a Muslim friend and this Muslim friend is so close to receiving Jesus because he believes in Jesus.
Walid: Ha ha, well they believe in a Jesus, but it is not the definition of Jesus in the Bible at all. They deny the crucifixion, they deny the Sonship, they deny the Trinity. And in 1 John 2:22 the Bible tells us very clearly who is the liar, he who denies that Jesus is the Christ, he is the man Anti-Christ that denies the Father and the Son. So there we have it, the Bible gives us the definition of Anti-Christ. Many in the west think that Anti-Christ is someone who claims to be Jesus when in reality he is not. That’s not Biblical; the Bible says the Anti-Christ comes to be as an anti against Christ; to deny the very essence of who he is.
Sid: Now you have a revelation from the Prophet Micah the Fifth Chapter verse 2 to 6 about the seven shepherds in the last days; and I have never seen this before but tell me about that.
Walid: Well, it is rare that you see a discussion on the seven shepherds in the Sunday school. When we look at Micah 5 it tells us about the birth of Christ in Bethlehem, but many western Christians don’t look at the rest of the verses that talks about the Assyrian which is the Anti-Christ when he enters into the land of Israel. And how God will raise seven shepherds and eight princely men and they will destroy the Assyrian. In other words those nations led by the shepherds will destroy the Assyrian. This by the way is confirmed to us in Ezekiel 28. Ezekiel 28 talks about the prince of Tyre.
Sid: So these will be seven that…but let me get this straight, so these will be seven nations that will team up together to destroy the Anti-Christ. Do you know who those nations are?
Walid: Well, we could be very suspicious of who the nations are or kind of allude to them because it says that the nations that will basically pluck him out in Ezekiel 31 will be coming from the ends of the earth. So from the Middle Eastern perspective the ends of the earth, you can see Australia, the United States, nations you know like you know the United Kingdom so we could elude to the Western nations, the Christian nations which God will basically purify in the end when he comes. In fact, in verse seven in Ezekiel 28 it talks about these nations and in verse eight it says very clearly that they shall throw you down into the pit. Who are the they? It goes back to verse seven, behold therefore I will bring strangers against you, the most terrible of the nations. Terrible doesn’t mean awful, it means terrible in battle, the most terrible, the most powerful nations in the world will come against the Anti-Christ and they will throw him into the pit! No one can argue against those verses. They are very clear that God will raise up nations against the Anti-Christ!
Sid: Now tell me about where we hear in Revelation the Seven Mountain and most people think these are the Seven Hills of Rome, but you have a totally different understanding.
Walid: Well, if they are literal mountains then when did five mountains fall? Because if you look at the Revelation it is pretty clear, five have fallen; one is and the other has not yet come. Hello, this is speaking about the time of the Romans when John was writing these revelations. Five have fell, one is, that is the Roman Empire and the other has not yet come; the seventh one. And it is the seventh one that the Bible is focused on and also it says this seventh one will be an eighth, hello it is very clear. Which nation conquered the Roman Empire? Of course the Roman Empire cease to exist in the West and continued to exist in Byzantium that is today Turkey, the eastern leg of the Roman Empire; there we have it. And so that was bruised by who? It was bruised by the Muslims; the Muslims took the mantle from number six when the Byzantium fell in 1451 by Mohammed the Second and Islam took over the Roman Empire. In fact Islam defeated the Roman, the Persian and the Babylonian.
Sid: Listen, they can get all of this in your book, but once you’ve literally cracked a Bible code which opens the whole end times scenario to make so much sense, and if for God’s children it doesn’t make sense who shall it make sense for? Tell me about your revelation on the number 666.
Walid: Well, we must conclude from the Bible what the Bible says about 666 and the number of the beast. The Bible in Revelation Chapter 13 it has three flavors. The mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. Well, first of all we have to understand what name means. Name doesn’t literally mean a name of a person, because we can look at verses in the Bible in which it says clearly His name shall be called Emmanuel which is God with us. But Jesus’ name is not Emmanuel; it’s talking about our creed that God came to us. Same thing with the Anti-Christ he has a name, a creed, it’s a blasphemous creed. The followers of the Anti-Christ will put that creed in a badge because the Greek term Charisma simply means the badge of servitude. They will put this badge on their foreheads, exactly what we see Muslims do. When we come to the three Greek letters, they resemble Arabic letters. The Arabic letters, clearly if you look at it in the Arabic and so far no one was able to refute that it says in the name of Allah. With the symbol of the two swords…
Sid: So the 666 in Arabic means in the name of Allah!
Sid: My, my goodness! Do you realize the revelation your hearing right now? I urge you to understand, listen if you don’t think we are in end times, have you looked at what’s going on in the Middle East recently?
Sid: We want everyone everywhere to be red hot for the Messiah but I believe that what the Spirit of God is saying right now is this is the moment for you to get closer to God than you ever had in your life. And the best catalyst for you to get closer to God, I mean He says that “If you draw close to me I will draw close to you. The best catalyst I know is worship and that’s why I’m so excited to introduce to you Nic and Rachael Billman and in particular their brand new worship CD called “The Least of These” recorded before an audience and the feedback we get on this brand new CD is people experience the presence of God. They literally feel God’s love flowing through them. Many hear the wind of the Spirit. Others hear angels, some hear supernatural instruments; many people get healed when they hear this music all over the world. And Nic the two of you have ministered a great deal in Brazil and you are getting ready to make that your base right now where you are going to live. Tell us that most of us are in America and aren’t use to seeing eleven year old transvestites and prostitutes out in the street. Paint me a picture of what the street is like in Brazil.
Nic: Well, it’s interesting because Brazil is a great nation, it is the fifth largest GDP in the world and yet a third of their nation live in abject poverty and so we’ve been on streets during the day it is just a market it doesn’t look any different than a street in the US and then at night around midnight or so there are prostitutes transvestites, drug dealers, drug addicts all over the streets. We’ve talked to girls as young as eleven years old on the streets, boys the same way. We’ve talked to those that started in that industry at six years old and it is just such a place and awesome place to find Jesus as we have had some of just the greatest encounters with people on the streets of Brazil.
Sid: And one of the statements you made is that the Lord showed you that if you don’t love lose that are around us and care for them then you don’t love the Lord?
Nic: Yeah, because as you look in Matthew 25 Jesus just talks about, he identifies himself as the least of these, and he says when I was hungry you fed me, when I was thirsty, when I was sick and in that verse if you read through it He actually unties our blessing, our righteousness and our inheritance into caring for the least of these and I really believe and feel like if you love God and you have Jesus as your Lord and Savior then you are going to love the things that He loves; you are going to love the people that He loves and you are going to take on the character of God, not just the title of God as a Christian.
Sid: Tell me one person that you ministered to in Brazil, make them real to us.
Nic: We had kind a separation of two different things that happened within a day from each other in our first trip to Brazil in 2008. I prayed for a little boy who is in line for healing in a church and he was born 80% deaf in both ears and I really felt the gift of faith for this boy and I got down on my knees and I just looked him in the eyes and I just said Julio Jesus loves him and his eyes popped open and he jumped into his Mother’s arms and she whispered in his ears, I love you and he whispered back, I love you Momma and his ears were totally healed. No speech impediment or anything and it was a very very powerful night. The next day I look out my hotel window and I see a boy that’s on the streets, he is actually on the cover of the CD that we just put out and he’s laying there and I just had this heart to go out and spend time with him, but I couldn’t find a translator.
Sid: Your heart has to go out when you see that picture.
Nic: yeah he’s fifteen years old, a story that I found out later was that he was abandoned by his parents and I just spent an hour with him without a translator just in fellowship, just in communion with him and then a translator was able to come help me and we went out and bought him some shoes. And after I gave them to him we spent more time with him and the next day he came to show me his bed, where he slept and he crawled up into this dumpster and laid down in this old terrible trash that jus t smelled so bad and that is where he slept and he was so proud to show me that he had a place to sleep that night; and the Lord was just showing me, you know Nic both of these things are worship unto me both of these things are pleasing; because in one hand there is a miracle and someone was healed and in then in another you acted as Jesus and you were compassionate to the poor, to the least of these. And there are no difference to the heart of God.
Sid: You were telling me that many times you’ll pray for someone and they’re not healed and rather than walk away you just love on them.
Sid: Explain that.
Nic: Well a lot of times we will spend time with someone and you get a word of knowledge for their healing and it doesn’t happen and it’s very easy for us to then say we’ll just keep believing and let them go on their way. But we tend to really try to love on them and we’ve seen things that when people come up for healing, and they don’t receive healing but we just begin to show the love of God to them, to love on them and they leave with a totally different heart, a totally different attitude and the bottom line is that God is always after your heart first and for most before everything else. So that’s really our heart’s desire is to administer the Father’s heart.
Sid: Well, I’m so pleased to be releasing your brand new CDs, its two CDs and the album is called “The Least of These” and tell me about the song, “Come Find Me.”
Nic: Yeah, this song was a spontaneous song that we sang one night, it comes right out of Matthew 25 and it was a vision I had had of all these churches that were alive crying out for God and we want to see Your face, come to us God we want to hear Your voice. And then I saw the streets of Brazil because that’s where my heart is but I believe it applies anywhere where there is drug addicts and there were transvestites and prostitutes and the widow and the poor children on the streets and the churches were all alive and there are people that are on the streets and God says come find me. So the church is crying out, we want to see you, then God says then come find me from the lost, from the poor.
Excerpt of “Come Find Me”
Nic: I was abandoned and you gave me a home, I was wounded and you healed me love. Just stare into the eyes the child that is left alone and there you’ll find me, and there you’ll find me. Just open up your arms to hold the least of these and there you’ll find me, and there you’ll find me, come find me, come find me, come find me.
Rachael: Come find me in the dark; come find me in the dark.
Nic: Come find me church, come find me run, come find me.
Rachael: Come find me in the dark, come find me, I am life, I am light, no darkness of night, I am light, I am light, I am light, no darkness of night.
Nic: Come, find me, come find me, come find me come find me…
Sid: My guest is red hot for the Messiah his name is Hank Kunneman and we were just kinda reminiscing on prophecies that He shared on past broadcasts that have come to pass and he has a Word on the Middle East in particular, Egypt. What did God tell you Hank?
Hank: One of the things Sid that God is saying is so incredible to me and it’s great for those that understand, you know prophetically what the Lord is doing in this time. And let me just say this it was back in 2006 with the Spirit of the Lord began to really began to prophecy that there was coming a shaking to Egypt and I had shared that on an earlier broadcast. One of the things that the Lord had also said was that we had found also was prophesied was when you see the shaking that takes place in Egypt know that it’s a prophetic sign that I’m going to do something with Israel and I am going to do something with my people, you know the Body of Christ that you know, the Christians. He said, I’m going to show them that it marks a season of separation and Divine favor. And so I want to read this prophecy, it says that it was on January 30th of this year. The Spirit of God says that even now all across the earth there is a shaking taking place and men have looked and they have asked what is happening. What is taking place in Egypt? And God says this is a sign unto this nation a sign unto the nations of the earth. For as it was in the days of Egypt where there was a shaking and plagues came as in the days of Pharaoh and there was a removal of a leader and a liberating of the people of Israel. God says, once again this shaking is taking place because it marks this season for the earth and for the nation of a season on Divine separation, I’m bringing a separation and there will be a difference that the earth will begin to see between that love me and those that do not know me. For my favor is coming in an unusual way and now this to this, for it takes place in Egypt and you will see a shaking and a removal of a leader and it will happen in the days to come. God says to look to the youth; do you see that they are rising? For this is a sign as it takes place in Egypt that there is a dissatisfaction and God says once again this will begin to be seen in other nations. You will see it take place in Iran, and you will see it take place in the other nations in the Middle East as you have seen it with the youth of Egypt. And God says, I will also cause the attempts and the assignment of what Iran has desired to do even against Israel. God says that it will implodes and I will cause the youth to begin to arise even in Israel. And Sid, maybe we can talk about the youth rising in Israel and I like what he says here. Watch the youth as they begin to arise in other nations of the Middle East and there will be changes of leadership and there will be regime change. Watch what begins to take place even in North Korea as an implosion begins to take place in its government of two who have held on to the seats and the reigns of authority. God says, I will cause an imploding to come to North Korea and the dividing wall between the two nations shall be removed. So you can see where the Lord is saying this thing with Egypt is a prophetic sign and it’s a various dangerous time.
Sid: Now what’s going to happen to Israel? I mean in the natural, without the help from the US Israel doesn’t stand a chance but then if you read the Bible they didn’t stand a chance in most situations without God’s help.
Hank: You know, the Spirit of the Lord said something to me very interesting and He was reminding me. He said, I’m going to humor the nations again. And I’m going to humor Israel. And if you read the scripture and I know that you do and the listeners as well, look at how many times God did things in the days of Israel like you know the crossing of the Red Sea you know, the different plagues that took place, I mean these are amazing stories and the Lord said to me Sid, I’m going to humor the nations and I’m even going to even humor Israel because I am going to show them I love. He said I’m going to use the elements once again, remember when God used the elements He caused the wind to I believe it was the locust up and then to be separated?
Hank: He used the wind to separate the waters of the Red Sea. God is once again going to use the elements over Israel as a sign to the nations of the Earth of the Devine intervention.
Sid: So in other words somehow the elements are going to be used to protect Israel just the same as the Exodus?
Hank: Yes, and it’s going to be something that is so undeniable that Israel will all ready know. One of the things that if people live in Israel, or they love Israel and they pray for the peace of Jerusalem as we all do is that we need to be comforted. Because one of the things that the Lord is going to do; Sid I had an amazing thing happen one time in my church here. We were praying on a Wednesday night and that’s usually when the prophetic atmosphere comes in and the Heavens begin to open. I literally saw something moving off in the distance and I couldn’t tell what it was and I looked up and I began to see it moving closer and closer to me and it began to frighten me. All of a sudden it moved so close I was now pulled into the vision and all of a sudden I looked and it was a horse, like right in front of me, it was so real it was like this horse had come into my sanctuary, I know that sounds crazy but I looked and I saw the horses hooves and I could see like these veins in the horses legs and I looked up at the horse’s head there was such a look of intensity in the eyes of this horse and the nostrals of this horse was breathing with incredible intensity and all of a sudden I fell to the ground I began to cry out to the Lord. And I looked up and I could see a leg on this horse and I followed it up and I looked and it was the Lord sitting on this horse and he was dressed in this incredible outfit like a chief with this huge headdress and he threw a spear down at my foot in this vision and the Word of the Lord came to me and He said, the zeal of the Lord of Hosts has been stirred up over America and over Israel and I will protect them. And it was the most amazing thing because, shortly after that the Lord showed me Israel and I could see this chariot that was going around and around the is nations of Israel and the Spirit of the Lord said, once again I am riding my chariot over Israel and even what is taking place, and I even hear that now Sid, if I could just speak now. Even in this day right now with Israel and there are those that are looking and they say God what does this mean in Egypt. Surely there is fear that have gripped the hearts of many but even now it marks a season of the separation of God as Israel begins to come into a new season and into a new day where they will say, God You are our defense, Lord You are our protector, Lord You are the one that has caused a veil to be removed, yes concerning Yeshua, the streets will be crying out and declaring the name of Yeshua, but there shall even be a veil that will be removed in the days that are to come for God says, I have waited for this time and now is the season and time for this veil to come. And God says for it to be removed it is a veil that is hidden discoveries, it has a veil that had hidden natural recourses that shall be unveil at this time and God says watch, I will give Israel oil for as it was in the days of the first oil that was poured out in the place of the Upper Room by My Spirit God says watch, once again, I will do this with Israel by causing natural gas, natural oil to spring forth from the very soil that has been held for me and hidden for this time as I bring Israel to a place of Independence that they will say the separation from Egypt in the past shall once again take place in the future. And I will protect them, I will provide for them and I will bring them into a new season of self sufficiency and a day of great rejoicing says the Lord.
Sid: I tell you the presence of God was so strong on that Prophetic Word. I would be remise if I didn’t ask you to share the prophecy you heard about the President of the United States and in particular the friend of Israel in the White House.
Hank: You know, people have been saying to me a lot you know, Hank what are you hearing for 2012 and the Spirit of the Lord said to me Hank, I don’t want you to discuss too much about 2012 yet even though we will as we get closer. You know there is too much chatter but one of the things that God has promised is this, He has promised that there is coming a friend of Israel in the White House and I tell you God is going to do this and it’s going to happen. And that’s why it looks as though the opposite is taking place but we need to as Christians and Jewish people and we need to unite together and pray because God is placing His hand upon a friend who will be a friend of Israel and there will be a relationship like we have not seen in a long time. And this is one of the other things that the Lord is going to do. First there has to be some turmoil and there has to be some things that take place not only in Egypt, you will see more than one removal of a leader, there is going to be a few, it is going to look disruptive but God in the end is going to defend His people. And He is going to bring an alliance greater after kinda a season on unrest between the United States and Israel. But ultimately there is going to be a shaking of hands and a tremendous bond that is going to take place in the years that are about to unfold.
Sid: Are we going to the United States become a third world country.
Hank: You know, many have prophesied that, I only prophesy in part I have not personally seen that Sid. I have seen as I have said before hiccups of just some things that may try to take our breath away for a moment but ultimately I see a restoration of God upon his people. I see the revival of God coming upon the streets and the cities, I see a youth uprising. Not like in Egypt but I see where you know there is going to be fighting in revolution, I see an uprising of a youth that uprising of a youth that are going to march once again and say we want God back in our schools, we want God once again and we want to be able to pray. We want the Lord of the days of old and there is…
Sid: Can you see the youth rising up against the sin of abortion?
Hank: Let me tell you, there is a mystery getting ready to happen Sid. And the Spirit of the Lord said to me one time in prophecy, and I was prophesying in this auditorium and I think I was at Mark Chironna’s church and I began to see the Statue of Liberty and the Spirit of the Lord said to me, look to the place where this nations was attacked where the blood still speaks and cries out from the soil. He said, look to Lady Liberty and I looked over and I could see the Statue of Liberty and the Spirit of the Lord said to me look to this, this is a mystery this sign unto this nation. I have held it from those that do not understand but I’m opening your eyes and I’m opening your mouth to speak this. America is coming into a season of the woman. And what I mean by that and I prophesied it before November elections that happened last year where the Lord even said that there was going to be removal of one of the woman which happened, it was the Speaker of the House and he began to say watch new woman begin to begin to be put in positions of political power and influence and then I believe that’s why the enemy went after a woman right after the first of the year because he is afraid. That is why he attacked that congressman…
Sid: Oh no, were out of time.
Sid: The world has been waiting for that middle wall of separation to come down, between Jew and Gentile to form this one new species of being. His Name Yeshua, in Hebrew, Jesus in English and then Paul goes on to say, it’s going to make the full dwelling place of God. The miraculous that we’re about ready to see is contingent on reaching your Jewish friends to make the body complete. Reaching your Jewish friends for Jesus; let’s make that clear. My guest, Dean Sikes is a man raised up by God to prophetically teach about how you, how everyone can enter the supernatural. And Dean you had an experience and it almost cost you your life several times that you learned a great deal about tapping into the supernatural of God, you call it two days in October. This happened in 2006, you’re on your own airplane and you’re flying from Pennsylvania to Kentucky. Tell me about that.
Dean, Well we were I had ministered in Pennsylvania at a teen challenge that night. I was getting on our airplane, God gave us the airplane because we had petitioned Him for it and He gave it to us and we took off and I was heading to Kentucky to speak the next morning at a school that had had a really horrific event. Five people had been killed and because of a young man who made a bad choice and we were flying along. Just my pilot and I was sitting in the back of the airplane. We were at fifteen thousand feet, it was a very cool night, I wasn’t bothering anybody, I had my feet up drinking a diet coke and eating a Little Debbie snack cake and suddenly I heard something that caused me to come out of my seat. There was a pop, I ran up the front of the airplane, asked the pilot what I had just heard, He was working through the systems, he had heard the same thing. And then suddenly, I looked out the right side of our airplane and the right propeller was no longer spinning we had just…
Sid: Now, wait a second, God supernaturally gave you that airplane. How could God allow that?
Dean: Well, I’ll tell you how, there’s a real devil and he comes to steal, kill and destroy and at fifteen thousand feet in an airplane that God did give us and we had what aviation that world caused catastrophic engine failure, the engine literally died right there three miles up in the air. We had to turn the airplane around on one engine, there was an airport about ten minutes behind us and those ten minutes, I got with God. And if you weren’t saved that night before you got on my airplane you were at that point because you knew this was serious. You know I learned a great lesson here about all of this, when you face an expected moment in your life, that is not the time to start planting a seed. That is the time to start calling a harvest and I did that. I went to the Word, because the Bible says the Word is the seed and I began to remind God of what I had been petitioning Him about about our safety cause months earlier God really began to deal with me about safety in aviation. And I began to just confess that no grave trouble will ever overtake the righteous; that He would keep our feet from falling, that no weapon formed against us will prosper. And truthfully that night I got a little on the scared side and the Lord said, “Get out of fear because fear and faith will never coexist, you stay in faith, say what I said to say.” And I began to just say it and I began to believe even more powerfully because faith really becomes faith when it has to work. When our pilot did an emergency landing.
Sid: There was no no plan b?
Dean: There was no plan b. You were not to have a second chance to miss the runway, and pull up and take off again. You had to stick this landing one time. Think of it this way. West Virginia, plenty of mountains, were going into a mountainous area unfamiliar terrain and suddenly my pilot get a God idea, he says, look down below us and there were the city lights coming up and he said there are no mountains right here because the lights are on, they are just there. He said I’m going to do a big circle and were going to drop altitude and he did, lined up the runway in front of us and I’m thinking about two things so I get out of my seat go to the front of the airplane. And said I go I know you’re busy this is serious, but I got to ask you a question. “Is there anything that you’ve not told me that we are getting ready to experience?” He said, “No, you know everything I know, why would you ask that question?” “My people perish because for a lack of knowledge.” I need to know something, is there anything that I need to know about? Number two question. “Did you put the landing gear down?” He laughed and said “Yeah, I’m glad you asked, but yeah, it’s down. Why did you ask that question?” “The little foxes spoil the vine. It would be very silly to go through in those ten minutes and forget to put the landing gear down and a lot of people forget to do the basics when they come into unexpected moments.” We landed safely; I got off the airplane and called my wife. Ten days later, I leased an airplane, I was in Chicago, I had three internal witnesses, do not get on this airplane. I proved stupid, is a real word and got on the airplane.
Sid: Wait a second, how did you do that?
Dean: Because, I got, what is the right word here Lord? I got careless with the anointing. You’re in full time ministry, you’re going all over the place; you’re speaking all the time, people are being ministered to. I stopped doing for a season, what had brought me success and when the Lord said to me, don’t get on that airplane I ignored it, thinking devil you’re a liar God is with me, His word is protecting me. But God gave me three distinct warnings. I ignored all three, I got on the airplane, we took off and climbing up to 6,000 feet up the left engine experienced the same thing that the right engine on my airplane had experienced. This time it was much more serious, because the left engine is known as a critical engine and the airplane was trying to turnover in air. And the Lord spoke to me; this is when it get exciting. He spoke so clearly, he said Gary, Indiana. I knew what to do, I said to my pilot, find out where Gary Indian is. We were six minutes away. I said, go to Gary. Fog was everywhere. You couldn’t see anything, we make the turn into Gary, Indiana there’s no fog, it’s as if God looked out over Heaven, blew His breath of promotion and all the fog split there the run way was. We landed safely, I got off the ground and I did something I had not done in a long time, I hit the ground and I cried and I said, that’s it and I began.
Sid: What do you mean, that’s it?
Dean: I broke my own law, Lord I can’t do this anymore. And I called my pastor.
Sid: Did you reach a point where you didn’t want to be in an airport anymore?
Dean: Oh Sid, I fought fear for two solid years. Every time I got on an airplane I heard the devil say to me, “I’ve tried twice I’ll get you this time; wonder who your wife is going to marry once you are gone? Is the insurance paid up on your life? You’re going down today. And I had to fight that, and I had to fight that. But interestingly…
Sid: See, if the devil could neutralize you and get you to have so much fear you wouldn’t fly your destiny would not be able to complete.
Dean: That’s it; see the airplane is a critical component to my destiny. I don’t need necessarily a big building or equipment, for me my necessity is a tool that lets me go further, reach more and get home faster. And that’s what He has given us and that’s what the devil was trying to take away, which would then slow down the ministry. So if you are going through something today, and the devil is trying to take something out your hands that God gave into your hands, guess what, you must me a viable threat to the devil, otherwise he wouldn’t be wasting his time on you.
Sid: Okay, you are surrounded, it’s thick that you can feel it and touch it, this fear. What do you do about it?
Dean: Well, for two years, I just kept confessing that he had not given me a spirit of fear, but that He was love. But what…my break though happened when I was in an airplane and I was at 16,000 feet flying right over Atlanta, Georgia, I will never forget about it; I took a picture from the airplane of the city and the Lord took me to Psalm 94. In the multitude of my anxieties Your comforts brought me delight. You comforted my soul and the Spirit of God, every single time that I would have fear come after that, I would recite that verse out loud. Lord, you’re my comforter, you’re taking away this anxiety it is not from you. I just receive the peace of God and I’m going to keep doing what I know you called me to do and I’m going to bind the devil according to Matthew 16:19; I’m going to stand on the Word, I’m going to believe you Lord and I thank you that you’ve delivered me. Not that you are going to, but that you have already done it, it’s a done deal. Now Sid I can go out there and get on an airplane and smile and have a great time.
Sid: You learned a lot of lessons when you faced the unexpected and the truth is everyone listening to us will at one time or another face the unexpected. Give us some nuggets that you found out from these experiences.
Dean: Well, you might recall that on the first issue, the first time we lost the engine the city lights and how our pilot saw the light and it lead us to safety; well the Lord taught me there that when you go through unexpected moments if you’ll follow the glorious light of the gospel it will take you to safety. I learned that, after it happened and people found out about it, they wanted to talk about it, but I learned a great lesson here never discuss what you are going through with someone who is incapable of helping you solve it because they very likely will just add more fear instead of more faith.
Sid: That’s a difficult thing to do because usually it might even be a close love one.
Sid: How do you keep that from them?
Dean: Well, you have to learn, well the Bible says it, even a fool, when silent is considered wise. Sometimes it is better to shut up and let everybody think that everything it’s okay then to really let them know what’s going on. Yeah, I had to learn how to call those things that were not as though they already were. And when we went through this, I learned probably one of the best lessons that I learned was, I had to identify was this a God sent assignment or was it from the devil? Well, if you go to Genesis the Bible talks about how God tested Abraham. How did He test him with his obedience? I fully believe that God does test obedience but it’s the devil that tests your faith. How do you know that? We have three children, would I put my put my three children on an airplane and take them to fifteen sixteen thousand feet and kill the right engine and go oh great, let’s see how much faith you have? That’s not love. So I knew I knew where this had come from. I knew the origin of this, it was the devil trying to do what he does, trying to kill, steal and destroy. But I also knew that greater was He that was in me, than he who was in that world trying to do that to me.
Sid: Give me one more quick nugget.
Dean: Well, I think one more I would hang on to as I was out there going through an expected moment is never give up; never, stop doing what brought you success. I knew what to do to get an airplane, God showed me how to do that, I knew how to operate it, as far as flying it, keeping it in the air, as far as you know the operational side of it. Having a really anointed pilot up there but I had to go back to the basics of confessing the Word, standing on the truth and not letting my circumstances dictate what was coming out of my mouth. I had to never ever stop doing what had brought me this success.
Sid: That’s a word for someone who’s listening right now, because it’s not like baseball; it’s not like the game of baseball. It’s not three strikes and you’re out, it’s when you stop swinging that’s when you’re out.
Dean: That’s right, that’s right.
Sid: Never ever give up. We’re making two powerful teachings CDs available to you. One is called “The Power of Petition.” Dean Sikes shares from his own life this supernatural key to get your prayers answered and when you hear these testimonies and when you’re lead step by step how to create your own petition from God; can they fail Dean?
Sid: They cannot fail.
Sid: And then the second teaching CD is a question that everyone wants to know the answer, everyone wants to discover “Their Own Destiny” and you have supernatural steps that you have outlined of how people can supernaturally find out their specific destiny with God.
Sid: Hello. Sid Roth here with Mahesh and Bonnie Chavda. And this is hard for me to comprehend. It will be hard for you to comprehend. A young girl is dying, days to live, liver disease, and Mahesh and Bonnie find out about this. Now I’ve heard for praying for someone. I’ve heard of laying hands on someone. But I have never, ever heard of what the two of you did. What happened with this young girl that was dying of liver disease, Mahesh?
Mahesh: Well her pastor and mother called me and said they heard the Lord tell them, “Call the general.” So they called me and said, “Pray for this little girl. She’s given up. They can’t do a liver transplant, it’s happening too fast. Her liver is bad. Will you pray?” And I said sure, and I got into the presence of the Lord, and I was in His presence for about 26 hours.
Sid: Now Bonnie, were you praying along with him?
Bonnie: Yes, absolutely.
Sid: And did you pray that length of time, too?
Bonnie: Yes. And you know, that’s one of the things about the Glory. You recognize that it’s the living presence of a person named Jesus, specifically in the emissary, who is the Holy Spirit. And he’s invisible, but that doesn’t mean he’s not tangible.
Sid: Okay. So you knew something good happened.
Sid: What did you do?
Mahesh: So I called the mother and the pastor, and the liver now was about normal. It was better than normal. It had been healed, completely healed.
Sid: How could they explain? She was dying.
Mahesh: That’s right. And they said, “We had nothing to do with her.” And I knew what had happened and I sensed. And that’s what I want to transmit to people and tell them we can get in what I call the glory bubble, the bubble of His glory.
Sid: But wait a second. I know about getting in the glory bubble. But what I don’t know about is both of you went in to that dying liver. Explain that to me.
Mahesh: It is because of Jesus. And it was if in those 26 hours we went through every cell that had been poisoned in her liver.
Sid: Now both of you were experiencing this? And did you confer? Did you say both?
Bonnie: No because when you’re in the presence of the Lord like that and He’s working, everything, though it’s very supernatural, everything, it seems normal. It seems natural. You’re caught up where you’re whole being is harmonizing with the reality of His being, and He is light, He is love, He is healing, He is joy, He is power. But it’s natural. Like you say, it’s supernatural. It’s natural to be supernatural.
Mahesh: And this has happened again and again. As we get in the bubble then it’s like you are a steward of the atmosphere around you. You don’t know to what degree, but that atmosphere may be five feet within you. But that, the presence of God, the shekinah, because we are filled with the Holy Spirit it should start emanating from us. It’s all because of Jesus and what he has done on the cross. But we can be in his presence, and therefore, you and I are supposed to be, and those watching us, are supposed to be ambassadors of the Glory of God.
Sid: But what was it like going into the cells in the Spirit? I’m just trying to understand this, Mahesh.
Mahesh: I felt like we were there and it was done, and the proof of the pudding was the healing of the liver. And when the Lord said, “It’s done,” it’s a mystery to a degree. But the Glory of God, the presence, was touching and changing the equation in every part of that little, the young lady’s liver. He was aware there was death and life was coming.
Sid: Okay. I can’t get enough teaching. I can’t get enough about the cross. I can’t get enough teaching about the Glory and that’s your specialty. Bonnie, would you teach for about a minute and look in this first camera, and then Mahesh teach, and then whatever God tells you to do, do.
Bonnie: I think the first thing that I would say: Calvary changes everything. Calvary makes the difference. It’s a supernatural, ongoing reality that, just like there is no victory without battle, the cross demonstrates for you that God has made every supply for every human dilemma, for every sin, for every bit of suffering, for every unanswered question that you have, the cross in its complete work has made all provision for that.
Mahesh: And it’s like where there’s radiation poisoning, there is no human agency that can heal nuclear contamination, let’s say. But sin is like that. We have been contaminated. But the amazing power of the cross, the resurrection of Jesus, loosened the Glory on Earth so that it can decontaminate every person who calls on the name of the Lord. Whosoever shall call on the name of Jesus shall be delivered, will be decontaminated in a sense. And I saw that literally, Sid, when my son was dying, and they said he’s dying of kidney failure, and the golden light surrounded him. He was screaming in agony and suddenly he got connected with the Glory of Calvary. And the Lord took away all the pain and recreated his kidneys, and now he’s 30 years old, healthy and strong because of Calvary. And whoever all the people who are watching, if they would exercise faith in the cross, God’s power and glory can come and heal and deliver.
Sid: Pray for people right now.
Mahesh: Right now, the power of God is coming towards you as we are talking about Calvary. The Lord is healing kidney disease. I believe stage four cancer is being cancelled out. There’s a lady who’s been struggling with breast cancer. The Lord is touching you right now. And the man, you’re retired but your prostate cancer, the Lord is touching you. The miracles for a baby that’s in the hospital. And we just thank the Lord for miracles happening. There are several things. If you have been a wheelchair, move your legs and see, and get up, because the Glory right now, from Calvary is emanating and changing the atmosphere around you, and healing is being released through the glory of Jesus Christ.
Sid: Are you catching anything, Bonnie?
Bonnie: The vibration. I can feel it’s like deep thunder and there are a number of you. And I see a young woman, in particular, with long dark hair and you’re getting a sense of a rumbling in your belly, and I just want you to know you’re beginning to feel the vibration. We talked about God being tangible and there is visitation for you. And there are three children, a family with three children or a mother, or an aunt that is presently watching for three children in your family, in your extended family. The Glory of the Lord is going to touch them. God holds their destiny fully and firmly in His good plan.
Sid: And God is healing hearts right now. Your blood pressure is normal. You’re going to bypass the bypass. You’re getting a new heart from Heaven. Mahesh, have people gotten new hearts in your ministry?
Sid: Absolutely. I like that. And Jesus said, “It is finished.” And I say it is finished because of the cross and because of the Glory.
Sid: My guest is red hot for the Messiah. He has a gift from God to help empower you to release the gifts that God has already put within you. And he’s got a tremendous background because he attended Rhema Bible College. He was one of their singers for seven years. But then he spent many years as a Coordinator of Prayer and Healing School. And I imagine Jim Hockaday, you have probably seen more miracles from that position you had out at Rhema as the Coordinator of the Prayer and Healing School then many people on the face of this earth.
Jim: Sid it was a real pleasure to have had those ten years there at the Kenneth Hagen Ministries. And you’re exactly right, we saw all kinds of miracles take place and throughout the ten years it was a constant flow of the supernatural.
Sid: We were talking about this subject before we went on the air and why is it that there was this flow, but there seems to be today, it’s just like we’re not seeing the miracles that the Bible says were suppose to see and could we need a course correction so to speak?
Jim: Well, I think the modern church that you might call Pentecostal, Charismatic, Word of Faith, anybody that’s just seeking to walk in the supernatural; I think that there’s a definite dividing line that we need to step beyond where we’ve been and begin to pursue the empowerment of the believer. In other words, I’ll just put it to you in a more simple fashion each believer is filled with the Holy Spirit and that alone should produce the miraculous. But when we’re trying with formulas to get God to do something were working so hard to kind of put ourselves in an approval place. And were not sure if we have faith or we don’t have faith or whether we got enough of the Holy Ghost or not, we’re not going to bold and assertive to stretch our hands out to see the miraculous. And when a man understands His position in Christ, that’s the beginning of the supernatural and I really believe that in this last day, were going to walk into and we are starting to see it now, a Jesus gospel where Jesus comes to the forefront and the relationship with the Lord Jesus is reestablished in the heart of every man that would seek the supernatural.
Sid: Has God given you insight beyond a hope as to what is going to be happening in the Body of Believer’s as far as the supernatural?
Jim: Well, just as the relationship that we’re speaking about here today that’s so much a part of your heart and mine; you know Daniel made a reference in Daniel 11:32 “That They Who Know their God will be strong and do exploits.” And we never should have varied from that. Every teaching should bring out more of a relationship with Jesus Christ, where you know Him and you’re willing to step beyond yourself. And I believe in these last days, what we’ll see so tremendously beginning to rise and it’s happening now; is every believer becoming a vessel through which God’s power flows. No longer will it just be just come and see the big show at the church because a particular minister has such grand miracles and yet that’s still a part of our teaching learning. But, I believe we’re seeing right now is a shift of where the believer is being empowered and the believer is beginning to see in the open market where his every day to day function is, the supernatural.
Sid: Basically what you’re saying is it’s time for believers to become normal as defined by the Bible.
Jim: That’s exactly right. I mean the word supernatural, it’s not supposed to be some mystical thing and yet there is some element of mystery to the supernatural. Its suppose to be a daily lifestyle of knowing God and moving in His power and His glory for the benefit of every person around us.
Sid: We have a six CD Seminar that you taught at Rhema. The title is “How to Develop Intimacy with the Holy Spirit.” When someone understands the Word and has truly developed intimacy with the Holy Spirit, when you teach this what types of reports are you getting from those that go out into the marketplace after having had this teaching?
Jim: Well, it’s very exciting to bring people to an awareness of the Holy Spirit’s indwelling presence. Because when we receive Jesus as our Lord and Savior at that moment, God’s presence comes to live in our hearts through the Holy Spirit and the wonderful experience that we have where the Spirit of God fills us with His power and there are many wonderful things that take place at that moment especially the gift of speaking in other tongues. These experiences and bringing people to an awareness of it it immediately changes their life. They begin to hear the Holy Ghost voice. They begin to move with the promptings of the Spirit of God and it’s kind of like, I’d say it like this Sid; If you like a roller coaster and you enjoy the thrill of the up and down and the twist and the sideways, then the more you know the Holy Spirit your life will begin to experience a real joy and excitement beyond your everyday routine.
Sid: Pull someone out from the thousands that you have trained that this had an impact on their life and what they’re doing today.
Jim: One individual, his name is Tyler, he’s a great guy; man I really love this guy and I’ll say it like this, he graduated from ORU and he’s the type individual that normally would be totally okay, and still is, just being in the background. Loves to play the guitar and sing and to be honest, I don’t know that there’s a real call of God on His life to stand in the pulpit. And when he came to us and we began to teach some of these things. You could just see the lights going on about how much God loves him and becoming beware of the Holy Spirit. Knowing how empowered he was by God. And I’ll tell you this one story that’s great. He has become so excited about the Lord Jesus and so bold in his faith. He was driving with his boss to Oklahoma City and on the way the boss began to relate to him how his wife has struggled and struggled and struggled with such pain and the doctors have done everything they could to find out the reason why the pain is there and they can’t find the reason. And this is so uncustomary of Tyler, but he pulled out a twenty dollar bill, put it on the dash board; looked at his boss and said. Call your wife and tell her that I said before morning comes, she’ll be completely free of pain. And if it’s not so, then you can take that twenty dollars and put it in your pocket. And before morning that woman was set free and today is still set free.
Sid: That’s someone who really hears from God.
Jim: That’s awesome, I love it.
Sid: But that’s supposed to be normal. You know I came to know a little bit, Katherine Kuhlman. The thing that impressed me was her relationship with the Holy Spirit. That’s what made her special. She had that and I’m beginning to believe that everyone can have that kind of relationship with the Holy Spirit.
Jim: I believe so too and the people that I’ve been around just like you and you saw that in her, that have that type of relationship, it is so infectious it will make you want you to know God that way. And I would say that by being associated with the late Kenneth Hagen, what a wonderful man of God he is and he was and the thing that empresses me and people will say, it’s his love walk, it was his faith walk, but the number one thing that impressed me was he knew God. He had a relationship with the Holy Ghost. And I remember him saying one day, I’ll never forget this, he said I’ve come to know the Holy Spirit as well and even better that my wife who sleeps the bed next to me.
Sid: Humph. And you’re finding when people take your seminar or hear you’re teaching that they can come to know the Holy Spirit the way any man or women in the Bible has?
Jim: The limits completely come off and it becomes how much fun you want to have spending time with God, hearing His voice, recognizing His presence. And I’ll say it to you like this as far as the great benefit that we see, if you didn’t know you had the ten dollars tucked away in that little special place then you couldn’t use it to purchase what you need and you’d go without; and we as believers we walk about in our daily life not using at very much of a percentage at all of the Spirit’s indwelling presence and His help. But when you begin to recognize it and you begin to acknowledge how awesome He is, at that moment life really just begins.
Sid: Well, the thing that impresses me is, I’ve gotten to know about you from our investigation, hearing from God is how you operate. You hear from God about your family, you hear from God about people that need to be physically healed, you have the relationship with the Holy Spirit that everyone should have. And the thing that I love about making tools like this available is that there’s an impartation, because he can’t impart to you what he doesn’t have.
Sid: But his gift is to impart to you the ability for you to develop intimacy with the Holy Spirit. And when you listen to these tapes, literally you’re going to have a jump start in your spirit. You’re going to activate your five spiritual senses and miracles start happening to those that sit under his teaching. He’s going to teach you insight on how to pray in the Holy Spirit far more effectively. I mean there was one thing that he said that’s really transforming my prayer life.