SID: You know, Katherine Ruonala is known for having intimacy with God. Katherine, if there’s one thing that you can help us with to achieve this intimacy with God, what is the key?
KATHERINE: You know, I believe it is fellowship with God through worship, through a life of worship. And worship is, I used to think of it as this strange conduct. Why would God want us to tell him how good he was all the time? But actually, worship is a Divine embrace. It’s like when I was a young mom and my little kids would see me when I came home, they’d put their arms up and go, “Up Mommy, up!” And I couldn’t resist. I’d want to scoop them up. And you know what, that’s what worship is like for us. We come to God and we say, “Up, Daddy! Help!” And he runs towards us, scoops us up, and just as we love on him, he loves on us, and he tells us we have to pray for supernatural help to handle how much love he wants to give us.
SID: Well is worship an event such as singing to God or is it a lifestyle for you?
KATHERINE: For me, worship is an absolutely lifestyle. It’s not just singing. It is actually living in adoration to God. Everything, the whole of creation is our invitation to respond to God in worship, to have fellowship with him and that’s where joy comes from. You could live joyful knowing that he loves you.
SID: You know, I believe if it didn’t release miracles, if it didn’t release favor, if it didn’t release healing, if it didn’t release solving family problems you would live a life of worship anyway.
KATHERINE: There’s nothing, nothing more glorious. We were created for worship.
SID: Would you worship God just for a moment. I want to watch you worship God. Would you?
KATHERINE: You know, I believe even as we talk about him we are worshiping him. The Holy Spirit, he leads us in revelation knowledge of him and then God manifests himself through us. As we are communing with him we get to manifest him.
SID: I feel his presence as you’re talking about him right now. Tell me a few miracles that have happened.
KATHERINE: You know, I believe that as we live this lifestyle of intimacy with God, God wants to show himself strong. We had a couple bring a little foster baby, 18 months old, to a meeting, and she, they think she had been shaken as an infant. Her eyes couldn’t focus. She had one eye would go this way, one eye go this way, and she had no sense of balance, had never walked as a result. And we just commanded her eyes in the name of Jesus to come straight, and in front of everybody, God just straightened her eyes. People gave their lives to the Lord on the spot.
SID: You know what’s so amazing, here we are in Jerusalem, and they have the Muslim prayers on loud speakers right now. I’m looking for the day that we have Christians worshiping the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the name of the one Messiah, the whole world, the Jew, Jesus, Yeshua Ha’Mashiach on loud speakers.
KATHERINE: Well you know, and when we see God do miracles it causes people to respond to God and worship. And I got called one night into the intensive care unit and a man had had a terrible accident. It was a logging accident. He had been in a tractor, rolled down a cliff and had huge gashes in his head. They had operated, but they couldn’t get all the mud and the gunk out of the deep gashes because it was just so deep and so dangerous. And so we worshiped God in the intensive care and just thanked God for healing. I felt the release of power and we just worshiped God there. I left. He was unconscious. We didn’t see anything, but I knew God had done something. Well the next day, the nurses said that they had never seen anything like it.
SID: What happened?
KATHERINE: As he was lying on his bed unconscious, suddenly the gashes in his head started spurting out all the dust and the mud, and the gunk all over his pillow, and he was completely healed. He didn’t even need an operation.
SID: Do you know something, when you have a lifestyle of worship of God there’s not enough that God can do for you. He wants to do so much more for you than he’s doing right now. But in fact, he wants to heal you right now. I know as a fact there are people with arthritic fingers, the pain is gone, and back and neck problems, what is God showing your right now? Pray for the sick.
KATHERINE: You know, I believe even as you’re watching God wants to touch you. We see so many people healed even as we pray when people are watching. So right now whatever you need, I believe the God who loves you more than life, even if you don’t know him, he wants to make himself real to you. He loves in a way that is practical. So right now in Jesus’ name, I’m going to pray, Holy Spirit, Lord, whatever the miracles they need touch their bodies. I thank you, Lord, for eyes being opened. I thank you, Father, for a brain tumor right now disappearing in the name of Jesus. And Lord, I pray above all that everyone watching, everyone hearing the sound of my voice, Lord, that they would have the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of you, the eyes of their understanding would be enlightened, God, that they would personally know you, that they would experience you and find you, and feel you, Lord, that you would be so real to them because you don’t want to be a concept to them. You don’t want to be just a theology. You want to be their friend. Lord, make yourself real to them. Open the eyes of their heart as they cry out and say, “help.” If you’re watching just say, “Help, Lord, I want to know you and I thank you, Lord.” You delight to him.
SID: There is something going on right now in the invisible world. There is a flood of liquid love coming out to you from Katherine’s heart of worship. There are rivers of living water pouring out to you right now. If you have never said with your mouth, God, forgive me of my sins, I’m so sorry. I believe the blood of Jesus washes them away and now that I am clean, I ask Jesus to live inside of me. Give me a new heart, a new spirit. Become my Lord. Use your own words. It doesn’t have to be my words. Just “Jesus help” was enough to get it done for me. But this is your moment to have experiential knowledge with the Living God and live a life of worship. Yes.
SID: Katherine, a word, when I think about you I think about two things. I think about miracles and someone that has such intimacy with God that the miracles are natural. To you, what does intimacy with God mean?
KATHERINE: You know, the Bible talks about us becoming one with him. Because of the cross we have the privilege of actually being one with him and his desire, the joy that was set before him was that we would fellowship with him. That is we could be real with him, talk with him and hear what he’s saying, and tell him everything that’s going on in our hearts. You know, I believe if we learn how to really lean on him and not try to work out things with our own understanding, but to lean on him, to involve him in every aspect of our lives then he makes our path straight. And I tell you what, Christ in us, he has big dreams.
SID: You know something that I’m, from the people I interview and my study of the Bible, of course, there’s something called being filled with the Holy Spirit, speaking in tongues or supernatural languages. But I hear so little and yet when I interview people that move in extraordinary miracles they have had what the Bible calls a baptism of fire. Tell me about the time you had a baptism of fire.
KATHERINE: Well you know, I would read people like Maria Woodworth-Etter and John G. Lake, and Smith Wigglesworth, and their experiences with the baptism of the Holy Spirit. And I used to think to myself maybe I missed something. I received the gift of tongues when I was about 13, and I’d pray in tongues, and that’s powerful. But I wasn’t doing the stuff that they were doing, and I thought what have I missed. And I began to think, well Lord, you said you were going to come and baptize with the Holy Ghost and with fire. So I just began to press in and contend with God, saying, Lord, I want a baptism of fire. And I tell you, God just began to do such a deep work on my life. I was forever changed and his power now, he manifests himself in amazing miracles.
SID: Describe a specific moment in your history and what happened with this baptism in fire.
KATHERINE: Well I used to go and rent videos, when I was mom with little kids, of people who moved in miracles. I’d watch Kathryn Kuhlman and different ones. And one day the video man that I was renting these videos from, he prayed for me. And as I walked off the bus I got in the car and suddenly the power of God came on me in such an amazing way. I shook and I laughed, and I cried, and you know, from that moment on things have been different. The Lord, he comes with such power and such holy boldness, and I believe that’s what the baptism of fire is.
SID: Now out of curiosity, were you always as bold as you are now?
KATHERINE: Sid, I was one of the most self-conscious and insecure people that you could have met, but it’s the perfect love of God. It’s in intimacy with him that his love casts out fear. You see, if we’re not receiving what we need from him we’re going to be trying to get it from everybody else. We’re going to be looking at them and trying to get them to make us feel better. We’ll be afraid to do things in case we don’t get our needs for affirmation met. But when you’re receiving daily from the one who speaks to you and loves you more than you can absolutely even emotionally handle, his desire is to fill you to overflowing so that when you are interacting with people you’re no longer needing something from them. You’re overflowing with a love that empowers you and casts out fear.
SID: You know, I’m reminded of a worldly saying: You’re so heavenly minded, you’re no earthly good. I call that a lie.
KATHERINE: I think it’s ridiculous.
SID: If you become so heavenly minded that’s the only way you can be earthly good.
KATHERINE: Well I think unless you are then you’re conscious about yourself. But if you are absolutely caught up with this one who loves you more than life, and I pray from Ephesians 3. There’s a prayer in there that I pray: Lord, that you would strengthen me with might so I could understand and know the love of God that passes knowledge. I need supernatural strength to actually handle that amount of love that he wants to give me. And as I receive that, that’s what empowers me to no longer be worried about myself and I get to see what he wants. I get to hear his heart and I am empowered to be as he is in the earth, which is really exciting.
SID: You recently got back from Nicaragua. Tell me, I mean, that is a country with needs. What happened?
KATHERINE: It was a very big meeting where many, many people came. They gave out free tickets to the prostitutes of the city and we saw such astounding miracles. I mean, the first miracle we did was open a deaf ear and then after that, suddenly the faith in the room was so high. I began to call out words of knowledge. There was a lady who had a tumor on her neck, another lady with a brain tumor who walked in unable to walk properly because of the tumor, someone with a leg significantly shorter than the other to the point that she had to hem her pants. I gave these words of knowledge not knowing anything about any of them being there, and they all came up and testified that the tumor on the neck had disappeared. The lady who couldn’t walk because of the brain tumor ran up the stairs to testify. The other lady got down and showed us how her leg had grown out and she was now able to walk properly.
SID: And what I find is when people start saying God is moving and God is not a respecter of persons, that means that if he’ll do it for one person, he’ll do it for everyone. I’ll tell you what, when we come back I want you to pray for two things. I want you to pray for miracles and I want you to pray for the most important thing. To God it’s the most important thing that you yourself have your own intimacy with God because it is from this intimacy that the Messiah says all things are possible. So don’t you tell me, “but”. I tell you God says all things are possible. We’ll be right back.
SID: Hello. Sid Roth here. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. I’m in the most supernatural land in the world, Jerusalem, Israel, the place that Jesus came at his first appearance, the place that Jesus is about ready to return, and the most important thing for you to know is you can have yourself experiential knowledge with God. God wants you to have experiential knowledge. And my guest is supernaturally equipped by God to help you just have experiential knowledge with God, but she operates in what is known as creative miracles, Katherine Ruonala. I’m going to tell you something. Get ready for your experience with the Living God.
You know the Wuest’s translation of the Bible says, “This is eternal life that you might have experiential knowledge of the Messiah.” Katherine, I don’t know how it happened, but at 12, your heart said, I’ve got to have more than religion. What did you pray?
KATHERINE: You know, I believe you need to be, we need to be real with God. And I was at a youth camp. Everyone was worshiping God, lifting their hands, and I just got real with him. I said, “Lord, I believe in you, but I can’t see you and I don’t know you, and it’s really hard to worship somebody I can’t see and I don’t know.” And I just said, help, and you know, right there in the middle of worship the Lord made himself real to me. I can’t explain it any other way than I was blind but now I see. He made himself real and from that day on I was different.
SID: But you know, Katherine, many times people have an experience with God, but then they get sabotaged along the way, called life. It’s like the devil knows something good is in your future and he tries to sabotage you. So the first two people that Katherine prays for that are dying from cancer, what happened to them?
KATHERINE: Sid, both of them died. And I tell you, I was so discouraged. I actually thought, you know, Lord, I love you, but I think I’m going to put this miracle healing thing in the too hard basket because it didn’t seem to, it seemed to be too risky to me.
SID: Besides that, you know what, you can get by without the supernatural.
SID: The words she said is true. It’s too risky and most of you don’t understand the definition of biblical faith is spelled R-I-S-K, risk.
KATHERINE: That is so true. It’s so true. But you know, as I was just putting this whole thing in the too hard basket, suddenly I had a vision. It was an open vision and the Lord spoke to me, and he said, “Katherine, you must believe.” You know, God’s ways are better than our ways and he said, “Lay hands on the sick and you’ll see them recover. Heal the sick.” And this was the way Jesus did it. He performed miracles and people then would listen as he told them the Good News.
SID: You know, this may be hard for you and maybe hard for you to believe, but when I first started praying for people, I had met Kathryn Kuhlman, I saw all these miracles, do you know the first at least 200 people I prayed for no one was healed, no one. One person died on me. The elders of the congregation said, “I don’t like the way Sid is praying for so many people.” But something in me would not give up.
KATHERINE: Well you know, I believe if you don’t change the subject, if you don’t quit, you win. And now we have seen so many people with cancer, incurable diseases healed.
SID: But this is ridiculous. Let me explain something to you. Jesus said, “You’ll do the same things I have done and even greater.” You told me that you absolutely expect God to heal at least one deaf person when you speak. You really have to have faith.
KATHERINE: Absolutely. Well you know, the Holy Spirit, it’s the Holy Spirit who does it. And pretty much every town I go into one of the first miracles he does is someone with a completely deaf ear gets their ear open.
SID: All right, what about something really amazing like someone with no eardrum? How do you get someone healed with no eardrum?
KATHERINE: I’ve seen four.
SID: Tell me one. Tell me about one.
KATHERINE: Four of those. Just recently in South Korea we had two people, one lady was born without an eardrum, instantly got her hearing restored. Another lady at the age of six had had a terrible infection that didn’t get treated and her eardrum was completely deformed and damaged. She had no hearing whatsoever. The doctors have just confirmed she has a perfectly formed eardrum. She instantly heard. God does this and then as soon as people can recognize, wow, that person couldn’t hear, now they can, they release their faith and amazing miracles happen without hands even being laid on.
SID: Now you teach that worship is the key to everything in life to the supernatural, to miracles, to solving family problems, to solving financial problems, just living this life in this crazy thing called life. Why is this worship so important to you?
KATHERINE: Well you know, how do you trust somebody you don’t know? When you know him, when you know how good he is and how much he loves us then it’s easy to trust him. Because I know him, because I know his love for me, his love for people, because I know his will is to bring life and healing, then I’m not putting my trust in a concept or an intellectual idea or even a theology. My trust is in somebody I know, God himself.
SID: When we come back I want to find out how you were baptized in the Holy Spirit.
Sid: We want everywhere to receive the manifestation from the invisible world to the natural world of your physical healing and I’m going to believe that many of you in the next two days are going to have physical healings. And I have on the phone Sandra Kennedy and she’s the Director of the Whole Life Ministries in Augusta, Georgia. Jesus literally she had a visit from Him and He showed her how to set up the healing schools which are nothing more than teaching people how to appropriate what God has given us in the natural realm. And if you’ve been listening all of this week you know I’ve been asking some pretty tough questions. Sandra there are many people that say all you have to do is confess God’s word to be healed. There are other people that say that’s a big crock, that’s a big waste of time what’s the truth about confessing God’s word can you get healed by doing this?
Sandra: Well you can’t get healed just by saying it no. It has to be a believing once you believe it it has to get down inside of you.
Sid: Well how do you believe it?
Sandra: Well the Bible says faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. So that’s why at the Healing Center here we teach you…first of all most people don’t know that it’s God’s will to heal. That’s because the number 1 enemy to healing.
Sid: They know that God can heal.
Sandra: Can heal.
Sid: But they don’t know if He will heal or if He will heal them.
Sandra: Right and so if you take the word the first time we do that is to show you in the word out of 3 witnesses out of Isaiah, Matthew and Peter. The Bible says “Out of the mouth of 2 or 3 witnesses let a thing be established.” So I pulled out 3 witnesses in the Bible who state up front that it’s God’s will to heal. And then if I can get you to say that it’s God’s will then you begin to confess what God says about you once you believe it. Now remember faith comes by hearing so you’ve got to hear and hear and hear and hear what God says. See what we do Sid we go to the doctor we get the doctors report and everything the doctor says is a fact I mean and it’s a fact you’re going to die unless something intervenes there. And so I don’t say ignore the fact I say that the word of God is truth and you take the truth is higher than a fact.
Sid: Well how about the people that go around saying “I don’t have cancer, I don’t have heart disease, I don’t have high blood pressure the Bible says that so I don’t. What would you say?
Sandra: Well I would say…first of all I’d talk to them a little bit because it wouldn’t take about 2 minutes to find out whether they are just parroting something they heard or whether they’re really in faith. I would say that I believe that I believe I receive my healing was the way the way that I would put it.
Sid: Would you deny your symptoms?
Sandra: I wouldn’t let my symptoms rule me I would deny no. I would simply say you know I’m having a little struggle here but I want you to know up front that I believe that I received my healing based on the word of God.
Sid: Would you say that if it hadn’t become a Rhema to you because of God you believe it but it hasn’t become a reality inside of you would you still say that before that happened?
Sandra: I would but I don’t think just saying it makes it happen I believe you have to do as God told Joshua we have to meditate on the word of God and listen and listen and listen it’s the whole center of the heart of the healing center. That you hear and you hear and you hear it from this teacher and that teach, from this angle from that angle until it becomes such a reality to you until you can say it with assurance “I believe I receive my healing based on the word of God.” And once you really do believe it you will I promise you you will see manifestations of healing begin to happen in your body. But again there a lot of people that are in mental assent a lot of people…
Sid: Explain mental assent.
Sandra: Well mental assent is just saying well I see it in the word and you’ve prepared me and your acting religious and you’re just saying a whole bunch of things because you’ve been taught to say it. But when you’re quiet and your alone by yourself and if I was a family member or I was a fly on the wall listening to you I would hear you say when you’re not around certain people I hear you say “I don’t know if I’m going to live or not, I don’t know if this is going to work, I don’t really know things get worse for me than better.” And when start that way that automatically tells me that you are not in faith. When you start with all of the negative stuff and you say one thing to one group of people and another thing to another group you know. What you say to the preacher and those that you want to praise God I had it but then when you are with family and this friend and you know I don’t really know I better get my will ready.
Sid: Or you want sympathy.
Sandra: Yeah and you are like I mean you are not walking in faith I’ll assure you you are not walking in faith when you’re doing all of that. Real faith and once you have it again faith comes by hearing you don’t just hear it one time faith comes by hearing and in the tape series that you mentioned and in the book that you mentioned. I’ve tried to help you decide very easily whether you’re in real faith or not or whether you’re just playing games in your minds.
Sid: And the wonderful thing is once you’ve nailed someone you show them how they can change their thinking.
Sandra: Right because once you can really believe and it all goes back again to the bigness of God. It always goes back to how big is your God? Is He can He do this? Do you know…do you understand His love for you, can you understand that He’s already done it? Are you excited about Him do you trust Him enough with your life, do you trust Him with Your health? Do you trust Him and even when you’re going to the doctor do you trust Him to be the surgeon, do you trust Him to be the one in the operating room? Do you trust Him when you take just medicine? Do you pray over it, do you believe God that this is going to do what it’s supposed to do? Do you thank Him and praise Him? See real faith praises God, it praises in the middle of the pain, in the middle of the problem you still praise Him for what He’s done in your life.
Sid: Where the rubber meets the road Sandra is playing with her dog and what did the dog do to you?
Sandra: Well he bite off it is a sheltie and I stooped down and she jumped up. Her tooth grabbed the side of my nose and her mouth closed on my lip and literally ripped off on the floor ripped off my lip. You know 3/8’s of an inch exactly.
Sid: So what’s the first thing that went through your mind when you realized what had happened?
Sandra: Well blood was everywhere and I didn’t know exactly what had happened and I thought…the very first thing that went through my mind was “Oh thank You Lord, thank You that you know I thank You and that this thing is going to be alright.” And then I immediately called and I went to the doctor, went to the emergency room. And I didn’t understand the extent of the problem all of this just happened last November so this hasn’t happened not long ago. So when I got to the emergency room they called a plastic surgeon. A plastic surgeon came in and he said to me that this so bad that we cannot really fix this so that it can look good. You know a plastic surgeon cannot correct this because you have literally lost the lip. And matter of fact he said to me Sid “If you were to take a nickel and put a nickel on the side of your nose on the left side of my nose and lay it beside of my lip that’s how much lip I actually lost.
Sandra: The side of a nickel; I mean ripped off. So I went…and when he said that you are going to have to go in surgery well I immediately said to him “Come here I want to pray for you.” I’d never laid eyes on him before. I said “It’s my lip it’s my face; and I’m going to pray for you to know what to do and how to handle this.” Well he came and I took his hand and I prayed for him. I wake up in the emergency room I mean in the operating room hearing him tell the nurses that normally I would have come in here and would have grafted the bottom lip up over the top lip and sewn the lip together for at least 3 weeks but for some reason I did not do that. From my point of view it was God, my prayer God that prevented him from doing that. And when I came out of the surgery he said “You will take 3 to 6 more surgeries to even…he said it will be like a cleft lip and you will be deformed basically.” And I said to him and now this is my confession I said to him “No I will not. I will never have another surgery my God will fix this lip, my God will heal it and put it back in the right place and will rebuild that lip.”
Sid: Okay Sandra I was with you recently.
Sid: I looked specifically at your lip I don’t see any problem. How much plastic surgery did you have?
Sandra: I’ve had none.
Sid: How did it heal? I mean they even said that plastic surgery you will still have a cleft lip.
Sandra: I’ve never had one… it has only been 8 months I’ve never had anything else done to it. What I did was what I teach. I took the word of God I began to speak to my lip and I began to say “By the stripes of Jesus I am healed lip I command you to move I command you.” I lay hands on it every single day I anoint it with oil and “I command you to reform yourself and to grow in the name of Jesus I command you to do it.” And again you saw me and when I went back to him he kept saying and as a matter of fact this is another point he’d pick up this big book with all of these pictures with cleft lips in it and he said “I want to show you this.” And I say “No I will not look at it.”
Sandra: And he said I want to show you what we’re dealing with.” I said “No I will not put that picture in my mind I will not look at it.” I said “What I will do is I’ll go back to my house I will find every lovely picture of me smiling that I have and I will put those pictures up and those are what I did I’ve never looked at that book and I never had any more surgery and you would have to look mighty close to see that it happened.
Sid: I looked close (Laughing).
Sandra: That wasn’t even a full smile Sid it would take a full year before I could have a full smile.
Sandra: You saw me a couple of months ago and I had a full smile.
Sid: I have on the telephone Sandra Kennedy I’m speaking to her at The Whole Life Ministries by way of telephone in Augusta, Georgia. Sandra you were telling me on yesterday’s broadcast it sound wonderful before you started Whole Life Ministries you had a visitation from the Lord 3 as a matter of fact. He showed you exactly what you’d do step by step things you had no way of knowing. Now that you sit back and see the center you see the teaching center that you have you only allow incurables to come there for the full time ministries. You’re getting even when you go out to minister 60 to 80% of the people get healed. You’re seeing this all happen now how do you feel? I mean you’ve see the vision and now see the vision transferred from the invisible realm to the visible realm.
Sandra: Well overwhelmed overwhelmed at the mercy of god the goodness of God and yet very excited, excited of how wonderful God is. I love knowing that God is really God today do you understand what I’m saying?
Sid: For sure there’s nothing more exciting for me than to see a miracle, to see 1000’s of people saved. There’s nothing more exciting for me than to see God show up.
Sandra: To see that He is still God He’s on the throne, He’s in the healing business, He’s in the saving deliverance business and He’s wonderful. He’s not mad with us He’s on our side He’s just a marvelous God. And to see that in action and see it working out in the church and here at the church we have not only do we have a healing center where people are coming across the nation and across the world are coming to our healing center. It’s only been in operation for about a year and a half or a little better than a year and a half. And the kinds of healing Sid we’re asking at this point that people that the doctors say they cannot do anything else with you you have a life threatening disease.
Sid: Tell me about what happens with…alright tell me about some people with cancer that have shown up at your doorstep.
Sandra: Oh my goodness this one it just blows me out of the saddle every time I think about it. There was a lady who was in Hospice program sent to Hospice to die. And cancer by the way is the number 1 percentage wise of cures that we have.
Sid: What type of cancer did this woman get that she had to get Hospice?
Sandra: This woman had bone cancer and it was in all parts of her body and to make a very long story short within this kept building we kept teaching her, teaching her and teaching her and it appeared that nothing was happening. You know a lot of people get discouraged they want…miracles are instantaneous but healing are progressive and people are ready for an instantaneous healing but yet when we go to the doctor we don’t get instantaneous healing we get progressive healing.
Sid: To me a healing means time a miracle is instant that’s the way I separate it.
Sandra: But see that’s exactly right but what happens is you have noticed a lot of people that they want God to do everything instantaneous even though they don’t require that of the doctor.
Sandra: And so we kept ministering to this woman the word of God. Again the heart of all that we do is taking the word of God and letting the word work in your life. There’s not anything on the face of the earth more powerful than the word of God. I mean it will work and it will work all of the time. And we kept pumping the word in this lady and pumping the word in this lady. And within finally a doctor, her husband and her children came and said to her “Momma go on home to be with the Lord we release you to go home with the Lord.” And they all left and walked out of the door and left her in the hospice bed and when they left she turned to the nurse and said “I learned at the healing center that I could live and not die and my God is in healing business and what He did for me 2000 years ago still works today I want you to get me out of this bed and set me in that chair.” And the nurse said “I can’t do that if I pick you up your bones will break.” And the lady said “They’re my bones and I’m not going to die anyway I believe that God has started a work in my body.” To make a long story short they picked her up and moved her. This lady today is cancer free back on the job working.
Sid: And what about the ones that are not healed?
Sandra: Well the ones that are not healed we teach them to get ready to meet Jesus. We make sure people get saved every single day in the healing center. We make sure that at least they know that they are saved and that they are ready to meet God. We make…
Sid: Kathryn Kuhlman used to say the thing that would break her heart is to see not that it was wonderful the ones that were healed but to see people in wheelchairs that came believing that they were going to be healed and then go back in the same wheelchair. How do you handle that?
Sandra: Well that is that’s heart breaking at times what it does for you you want to go in there and jerk on and act like you can do it but I can’t heal anybody I can’t heal gnat I can’t heal a fly I’m not the healer. Jesus is the healer but Sid I’m a firm believer that if you get past religion. I believe that religion is probably the number l thing that stops us from moving and accepting what God has for us and I believe religion gets in our way. And if I can get you passed religion and get you to believing and trusting God I really believe that if you’ll give me enough time, and that’s really the criteria for the healing center is time. And by the way we insist that people keep plugged in with their medical doctor.
Sid: Now why do you do that?
Sandra: Because when you are healed the doctor will see it he will know it. We don’t tell people to throw away medicine, we don’t tell people to not take their therapy or whatever they’re going through. We do many times to ask the doctor to go and run new tests if they know that they have been healed. And people know you can get a knowing inside of you and when you know that you are healed not based on how you feel, not based on what it looks like but a knowing inside of you. Sid that’s true with people who are when you get saved.
Sid: Now let me ask you a question I’m really pondering this thing Sandra. I just read a book by Smith Wigglesworth and he had kidney stones I mean horrible condition I mean here the greatest healing ministry the world has ever seen and he’s in agony of pain and it wasn’t for a month it wasn’t for 6 months. The doctor said “Well look all we have to do is operate on you and we can solve this problem.” And he said “No I’m believing that my manifestation will come without a doctor completely by God.” After a period of suffering for years which could have been alleviated by going to a doctor he was healed. I don’t understand why someone like him didn’t receive it instantly.
Sandra: God knows I don’t know.
Sandra: Laughing I really don’t know but what I try to do is build people’s faith.
Sid: Well you teach in medical schools.
Sandra: Yes and the doctors in this city refer people to us and we have doctors in my church who are on our healing teams and who are part of the healing center nurses and all across the medical profession they’re very much involved in what we are doing. But what I tell people is live and not die; get inside of you that you will live and not die and give God glory. And if you need to go to the doctor and you need to have surgery then go but don’t go out of faith make sure that you’re in faith.
Sid: Now if God tells you to go then you have faith that the doctor will heal you is that what you’re saying?
Sandra: I mean you’re a believer and make sure that you have prayed and make sure that when you’re taking your medicine if you need medicine. Again Sid if I need medicine I’m going to take it, if I need a doctor I’m going to go. I don’t believe that the doctors are against…I don’t believe that the doctors are doing one thing and the God’s doing another I believe that they’re working together. And so I do not in any way suggest people do not go to doctors but I do suggest that you learn to use your faith even when it comes to the medical profession use your faith. Pray over your medicine your medicine say all of these evil side affects no you pray and put your faith out there. When you take the medicine it’s going to work for good in your and all of this evil stuff is going to come to you and what we try to do is teach how to develop your faith to try to receive faith.
Sid: Now you did not you told me you don’t have the actually statistics but on the meetings where you go out you see about 60 to 80% people healed you have statistics but at your healing center where you at this point your only taking in people with incurable diseases are you seeing high percentages of those people manifest.
Sandra: Very high percentages. I mean we’ve had people who’ve had stokes gone back and when they take tests they can’t even find that they have even had a stroke. We’re seeing all kind of cancers, cancer of the throat, bone cancer, cancer in the blood, breast cancer, colon cancer you name it.
Sid: You’re seeing tumors fall off of people.
Sandra: We’re seeing tumors fall off of people, we’ve had blind eyes open, deaf ears open, dead ears pop open. We’ve had people on kidney dialysis and they’ve come off of the dialysis. We’ve had people with diabetes be totally completely cured of it. I’m not talking about anything but the word of God.
Sid: You know I’ve seen people that get into alternative medicine and I might add I’m ready for regular medicine and I’m for alternative medicine but I see people get in it and I shouldn’t be a judge but it almost appears that they have…with the faith that they have in the alternative medicine if they have the same faith in the word of God they’d get their healing.
Sandra: Oh yes I agree it’s seeing. The word most people don’t even know what the word teaches. Most people don’t even know that the Bible proclaims that on the cross of Calvary that Jesus not only took care of our sins but died for our healing. Most people don’t even know that.
Sid: But most people I mean you really nailed me in a couple of areas things I knew but they…
Sid: My guest by way of telephone at her center in Augusta, Georgia, that’s the Whole Life Ministries Healing Center is Sandra Kennedy. On yesterday’s broadcast we found out that she was the first woman in the nation to be ordained Southern Baptist Church. But she almost got kicked out because she’d had a call since 6 years of age by God to pray for the sick. And in the dormitories every one of them that was getting sick she was praying for and they were getting healed but that was against their theology. She did graduate but they did force her out of the dorms by the way. And she bumped into a guy by the name of Harold Bradeson and he prayed for a bunch of people to get baptized in the Holy Spirit she was disappointed she wasn’t. She walked up to him and said “How come?” He said “You have a spirit of rejection.” She remembered her parents had been divorced at a young age in the name of Jesus he broke that she still didn’t pray in tongues. And one day she’s driving her car and all of a sudden what happened Sandra?
Sandra: All of a sudden I was caught up in the Spirit and in the throne-room of God and I get in what some people would call an open vision. Now I was caught up and I saw whom I knew to be God the Father but I never saw His face. I saw from like the bosom down and I saw over in the corner a small child 4, 5, 6 year old and I recognized it to be myself. And I’m watching this and He reached over and clapped his hands like a daddy would clap his hand for a child to come jump in His arms. And that young child who was me went and jumped in the arms of my Father my heavenly Father. And when that happened it was no longer that child it then became me and I began to speak in tongues. And I mean I spoke I believe I spoke in every tongue known to man. I’ll never forget it I mean I just talked and talked and talked in my language kept changing and I talked and talked. And then the next thing I know I’m sitting in front at my house in my car in front of the garage door which happened to be 22 miles away from the incident.
Sid: Now do you believe the Bible talks about being translated in the Spirit? Philip was translated in the Spirit do you think that was what happened to you?
Sandra: Either that or either again what people call like an open vision where you go of course that was exactly what I thought when I had the same similar experience when I started the church here Whole Life Ministry the same identical type thing happened to me. As a result of that I had was driving outside of Dallas, Texas and was caught up and was standing with the Lord again I don’t know who drove the car I was coming down I-20 the car was no longer there and I was standing with Jesus looking at the front of a building that said “Whole Life Ministry” with Jesus looking at it.
Sid: Now of course that building it did not it did not exist at that time.
Sandra: No it did not it did not exist and He took me by the hand walked me through it showed me the components of the ministry, told me what to do and what not to do. How to set up boards of the church and all different kind of things that I knew nothing in the world about and I was at that point wasn’t even Spirit filled when this happened.
Sid: Now you know the Bible says “Jesus only did what He saw His heavenly Father doing.” I imagine that’s the way Jesus did everything He was instructed and just acted out what He was instructed that’s the way it should be. That is so wonderful…so you saw this whole thing. Just of curiosity from the time you had that vision of having this whole center and how to set it up and being told how to do it did you have a fight to get to happen?
Sandra: (Laughing) It took me 10 years to act on it as a matter of fact I had that vision 3 times. Because of my background, because of me being Southern Baptist, because I’m here in southern Georgia Southern Baptist was birthed here in Augusta, Georgia. I had never met another woman minister, I did not know of a woman minister. And the 3 different times of degrees that I have from Southwestern Seminary I had never heard about Aimee Semple McPherson, I had never heard you know I had seen maybe something on TV about Kathryn Kuhlman but I’d never known of any woman minister it’s pathetic but I hadn’t I never knew. So in my mind I could not do this thing and it was one of the greatest battles and there were people I knew who to ask were my friends who were Southern Baptist and the pastors who I knew who were Southern Baptist of course they all told me I couldn’t.
Sid: So you had a bunch of Job’s friends.
Sandra: Yes I did (Laughing.)
Sid: And so it really toke you 10 years.
Sandra: Ten years.
Sid: You think you could have started it the next year if you had moved?
Sandra: I believe if I did not have so much religion in me. I believe if I did not have so much so much of man’s interpretation of God’s word in me. If I had just had the faith to just move on it without asking everybody and asking everybody’s opinion but just doing what God had said and realizing the God’s not a man that He should lie and just walk on what He had done in my life I believe in all honesty I could have started it so many years earlier.
Sid: Now at that time did the Lord…He showed you the future as to what it would be but what did He tell you did He tell you what ultimately what your ministry would be?
Sandra: He just simply when He pointed out again He name it “Whole Life…W-h-o-l-e Life Ministry and said basically that the church could teach the fullness of God. We should minister to the whole man spirit soul and body.
Sid: Now why did you have such extraordinary miracles happen and such high percentage of people being healed at your place?
Sandra: Well I think there it’s pretty clear because it’s so scriptural if we teach the word of God we do not try to give you our opinion. All we do is take you and walk you through the Bible and let you decide for yourself what the Bible has to say about healing. And so all we really do is I take this wonderful book and I do my very best to make you fall in so love with Jesus that He is so big in your life that you see that He so loves you and the goodness of God that it becomes almost a normal response to say “Well my goodness I see where He wants me well, I see the provision that He’s made for me.” Sid I’m convinced that this ignorance of the word of God and religious teaching that make us miss the simple things of the gospel.
Sid: And now I’ve been looking over some of the things that have happened there such as 6 brain dead individuals that have come back to life that were healed. That’s brain dead 6, 7 women with total hysterectomies have gotten pregnant. Tell me about this woman whose eye was disconnected and the eye was dead tell me about that.
Sandra: This was a woman that had the eye died well she had an eye transplant and then the transplanted eye died and became disconnected from the socket. This woman when we prayed for her and told her about the word of God I did not know what was totally wrong with her eye. I assumed that she had glaucoma or that she had cataract something I did not know all of the information that we now know. We just prayed and believed God and taught the word of God about healing. And the woman then began to shout and scream and carry on and then call forth colors there were banners around and she began to say blue, green, gold, yellow and began to red.
Sid: Now let me say the transplanted eye was disconnected and you didn’t connect it back all you did was just pray.
Sandra: All I did was pray and out of the dead disconnected transplanted eye she began to see.
Sid: Is anything impossible for God?
Sandra: Not a thing!
Sid: I mean you really believe that.
Sandra: I believe that with all of my heart.
Sid: So how come I know people you you know people everyone listening to us knows people that were strong in faith, believed God’s word, had good teaching and did die?
Sandra: Well you know I don’t know that I know all of the answers there’s some things that I can’t give an answer to but I do know this; I know that you can have faith and have tremendous faith in your life and not understand faith for healing and I think that’s very important. I have people say to me go visit so and so in the hospital and say to me up front these are wonderful Christians and they really have a lot of faith, they really believe God and they know that God is the healer and understand what I said “They know that God is a healer and they know that God is a healer would you go to them and talk to them and pray for them?” And many times I go and what I find out is yes they do know, yes they are wonderful people, yes they do love God, yes they are born again and yes they do know that God can do it. But they don’t have the assurance in their heart that God has already done it that’s a major difference.
Sid: I’ve been listening to your 2 audio cassette series titled “Genuine or Fake (F-A-K-E) Faith” and you nailed things to such a degree. I understand that that’s required listening for your healing teams and then you wrote a booklet called “Preparation for a Move of God.” Do you really believe that there will be a move of God?
Sandra: Oh I believe it I believe we’re already in it. I believe we’re in it you know the Bible talks always about remnants that God talks about remnant. And God deals with a remnant and I believe that there’s a remnant throughout this nations who’s hungry for God. I mean they all ready to lay down all religious teachings…
Sid: But I don’t see how most people can be satisfied where they’re at; if someone tells me they’re satisfied I’ll tell you there’s something wrong with them.
Sandra: I agree 100% I mean there’s such a hunger to see and to know God better and to understand Him and I believe with all of my heart that the church should be the powerhouse of God. I believe the church should be the stronghold of community; I think the church should be the authority center of the community. That we should be the place that understands what living a godly life is about. We should be the place when people are in need…I’m not talking about financial time to get all of your bills paid on but I’m talking about wanting to be fulfilled wanting to find your destiny, wanting to find your purpose knowing the blessings of God, the goodness of God. The church is the place to come we should be the powerhouse of God. There’s not anything too big for God and the church should be holding up that banner. We should be holding elbows with the community.
Sid: Sandra I’m sorry we’re out of time.
Sid: We want everyone everywhere to care for orphans, widows, poor and oppressed. We want everyone to care for these helpless people like God cares for these people like God cares for these people. I was telling on yesterdays broadcast we’re making available this week a booklet perhaps the most important book that Derrick Prince has ever written it’s called “Who Cares for Orphans and Widows and the Poor and the Oppressed? God Does.” Do We? And he brings out truths that I just never seen before that Old Covenant Prophets the New Covenant Prophets with a heart of God. I believe that there are many listening that are calling out to God saying “God give me a ministry.” I believe that as you read this book God’s going to give you a ministry we’re such a blessed country. And if there’s ever been a time to meet this mandate it’s now. …I’m speaking to a couple that took this message seriously Joan and Bob Nast. And they had a vision from God they had such a supernatural burden for children that were either seriously ill or dying. And God directed them they bought a farm and they’ve had 1000’s of children AIDS victims, seriously ill children and they give them joy. I mean more important than joy I mean these children see angels. Many are healed, many experience the presence of God coming from every background imaginable. So one day Joan you are traveling with Benny Hinn’s Ministry because you love to see miracles you love to see people saved. But one meeting in 1995 there were a lot of witches present and they were praying against the meeting. And I imagine you didn’t think much of it but what happened 5 days later?
Joan: Well I got deathly sick leaving the crusade so sick that I could smell the dampness almost the death smell in the taxi cab. I was literally starting to throw up, Bobby had to carry me up to the hotel; I stayed up all night on the bathroom floor deathly deathly ill.
Bobby: It just came on her instantly.
Joan: And he knew that this was spiritual even though we weren’t that knowledgeable about it. I stayed sick for 3 days very very sick. By the time we got back to Florida all of a sudden coming out of the shower we noticed this huge lump on my breast within 5 days of the crusade. We immediately called the surgeon, no my gynecologist and at first he didn’t think it was cancer I went for a mammogram and when I came out from the mammogram the technician said to me “Oh my god you have cancer and you better get to a surgeon immediately but look at this it’s an actually shape of a witch on your mammogram,” and there surely was. Long story short fear panic came over us in the beginning and we went to Benny Hinn’s Church and…
Sid: Did it really look like a witch?
Sid: I mean I’m still thinking about that.
Joan: Yes in fact there’s a magazine we’ve been on television with it but there’s a magazine one of Benny Hinn’s he put a picture of my mammogram in there and it went out to 250,000 people. And no one ever even questioned that this is a definite shape of a witch exactly where the cancer was.
Sid: Hm. So what happened next?
Joan: Well I believe that the miracles started by the word of God getting down in my spirit. We went up to a service up in Orlando at Benny’s church and Lester Sumrall was there. And actually I think it was one of his last meetings.
Bob: It was it was his last.
Joan: It was the very last time he spoke because he died shortly after that. Benny said “For all of you people who will listen to the Holy Spirit at this moment I’m not taking up an offering for our church I’m taking up an offering to feed the hungry. Now you know that Lester Sumrall feeds the hungry around the world and so whoever will listen to the Holy Spirit come up and give to that ministry not ours.” We immediately got to our feet and ran forward and God spoke to the both of us that we must plant a $1000. Well we sat down.
Sid: At that point how difficult was $1000 to plant?
Joan: It was difficult, it was difficult.
Bob: It was very difficult at that time.
Joan: It was very difficult at that time.
Bob: You just know that you know that you know that you just had to do it just God gave us a $1000 right now right in our head. And I looked at her and she looked at me and we just knew.
Sid: You both heard a 1000.
Bob: We both heard it yeah.
Sid: Okay I’m glad because that first vision that Joan had she just saw it not in the vision.
Joan: But Bob tell him real quickly what God told you 2 weeks after we wrote the contract on the ranch.
Bob: Well 2 weeks after we wrote the contract on the ranch I was still not sure if she really heard from God. And I said “Joan you know we’re putting our house; we’re going to be putting our house up for sale I said “We were going to stay here until Jesus comes back this is the house desire of our heart we have been looking at this house for 10 years that we were going to live in this area.” And I said “Are you sure?” She just said “Bobby I know that I know that I know.” So one day I was in prayer in the morning and I’m saying and I was travailing that’s what I was doing I said “Lord am I doing the right thing here and I making the right decision how come You haven’t spoken to me You always speak to both of us how come you didn’t speak to me yet?” And I heard Him say loud and clear He just said “You just follow the leading of your wife she’s doing everything that I’m telling her to do.”
Sid: Was it almost like an audible voice?
Bob: Yes, yes it seared so far into my heart that I burst out in tears.
Sid: For those that are just tuning in for the first time Bob and Joan had a half a million dollar home. The home of their dreams and they have no extra money and Joan has a vision to set up a farm for seriously ill children and give them a little joy in this life. And so she goes to buy the farm and she didn’t have money for down payment and she takes her jewelry off and there’s another man that’s giving a nice check for down payment and the owner says “I’ll take her jewelry I want to do something for God.” And what God is saying he didn’t get conformation he went along with her and then God gave that confirmation. Let’s go back right now you’ve got cancer and you’re giving $1000 to feed the hungry and what happens next?
Joan: Well after we gave $1000 Benny said “For all of you people that just gave to feed the hungry…
Bob: In fact what impressed me was he stopped other people from coming up because he says “Stop.” He said “A lot of you people are just doing it out of emotion now he said the first people that came up here were the ones that heard from the Holy Spirit and he said “Everybody else sit down.” I was very surprised at that.
Sid: In other words he’s turning down money.
Bob & Joan: Yes he said “That’s it he says only the people that heard from God are supposed to get up here, when everybody jumped up at once that was the move of the Holy Spirit. He said “Now you’re just doing it just to be there” and he stopped it. And I was really taken back by that.
Joan: So he said “All of you just gave you will be able you don’t know what’s coming around the corner you don’t know if attacks are coming against you but what it does and when it does you will be able to stand on Psalms 41. Psalms 41 says “For those who feed the hungry or take care of the poor God will sustain them in their time of sickness, He will turn their bed of languishing around and they shall live and they shall not die.” He said “People I know that maybe this means nothing to you at this moment” which it meant nothing to us at that moment but it was that week I found out I had cancer. And the fear that came over us was tremendous we went home we’re sitting there I would cry he would cry back and forth back and forth. After going through this terrible battle with fear for 2 days before I went in for the surgery all of a sudden Bob grabbed a hold of me one night and he grabbed the Bible and opened up to Psalms 41 pull he off the couch started shaking me “Joanie you’re not going to die you can’t die, he said “We feed the hungry and take care of the poor.” He says “Psalms 41 says that “You shall live and not die and all nations shall call us blessed.” He said “Do you understand that, get it down in your spirit you’re not going to die.” And at that moment it went down in my spirit and that night fear actually left and I felt it come from my stomach and a black cloud came right out of my mouth at the service that night.
Sid: Wait, wait wait. You imagined this you saw this?
Joan: No I saw it, I saw it I started praising God that night at the service because of fear I felt it going. And I said “Oh God forgive me for doubting forgive me I know that I’m going to live now I know that I’m not going to die.” And all of a sudden as I started praising God from the pit of my stomach I felt something moving up through my chest. And out of my mouth I actually saw a little black cloud go “Puff” and it was a spirit of fear left me and it’s never returned.
Sid: And you know the people that really keep in the spirit tell me that people die from this fear more than sicknesses.
Joan: I asked the cancer specialist that when after she operated on me she said to me “You don’t have any fear do you?” I said “No I’m a child of God I’m not going anywhere.” And she said “That’s amazing.” I said “Well spirits of fear you know.” And my doctor was Jewish and I said to her “Well God loves me and has a plan for me” and I said let me ask you something when you see people fearful do they die quicker than others?” She said “Most definitely she said they’re consumed with the fear.” And I actually asked her if she knew what the spirit of fear was and she said no. And but the prognosis with me got worse after that week because after they operated and took out the lump…
Bob: Joan I hate to interrupt you but just tell them what you did to the doctor before you went into the operating room this is really neat Sid.
Joan: Well my doctor was Jewish and she was a fabulous surgeon and I trusted her with all of my heart. And I was going into the operating room and it was 6:00 in the morning and the Lord spoke to me to open the Bible to Isaiah 53 and write down all of the verses down. So when we were going into the operating room she said “Well kiddo are you ready?” And I said “Well not exactly.” She said “What do you mean?” I said “Well on the way down I have a piece of paper Isaiah 53 you are not going to operate on me until you read it I’ll know so you better not.” She said “I promise I will, yes I will.” So I went on to the operation you know praise God greater is He that’s in me and every word of God that I ever put in was coming out. So…
Sid: So were out of time…
Sid: My guest by way of telephone Bob & Joan Nast I’m speaking to them at their office in Coconut Creek, Florida. And the last couple of days we found out that their life was headed for a real disaster. Bob was involved with a syndicate that was counterfeiting 6 million dollars. They got caught he could have been sentenced up to 60 years in prison instead a miracle happened. And he got just 6 months and while this was going on all hell breaks loose for Joan and he’s involved with a crime syndicate and she’s involved with drugs. And her close relatives as dying, her husband’s in prison, and her daughter comes in 14 years old and says Mom if you don’t go to church with me and there isn’t a change in your life I am leaving this house at 14 years old and get this “And I’m never returning.” Well Joan didn’t want to go to church she had a Catholic upbringing she figured that there weren’t any answers for her there. But she didn’t want to lose her daughter so she went and she had an experience with God in which Jesus put His arms around her and embraced her. And to make a long story short at the identical time as this was going on Bob in prison at the exact time gets on his knees and starts repenting before for messing up his life the exact same time. So he gets out of prison everything is going along fine she’s a successful Real Estate woman, he’s a developer they’ve got a half million home on intercostals waterway Ft. Lauderdale they’ve got a nice boat everything is going good. And then they meet a young boy 10 years old dying of Leukemia his name is Brandon. And they see how difficult it is for the parents and they want to give the parents a little relief and so they let the parents go and they’re going to stay with Brandon and a whole door opens for them. One day Joan is looking in the classified sees some property for sale and literary the property looked awful when they went there. But she had a vision from God and she saw what it could be. And so she walked up to the owner and what happened next Joan.
Joan: And as I approached the owner a man with the Porsche was there handing the owner what I found out would be $25,000 cash he wanted to buy the property that day right then and there.
Sid: But you’re supposed to buy it.
Joan: By then I knew that however I didn’t even ask my husband I didn’t discuss it with him. And the reason were married and have a good marriage is we pray together and talk together but not this day this was totally different. I walked up between the 2 men and I said “Excuse me I come here in the name of the Lord and we are going to buy this property today we do not have any money but I’m going to give you my jewelry and I have a lot of jewelry.” And I started taking off my jewelry and I started taking off my necklace, bracelet, rings…
Sid: Now you didn’t have any money because the stock market had taken a big turn down.
Sid: And so you were current but you just didn’t have large sums of money to buy this property go ahead.
Joan: No cash.
Sid: I mean that’s chutzpa lady you took your jewelry off and handed it to a man while he’s being handed a check from someone else to buy the property.
Joan: $2000 cash.
Sid: You’re in real estate that’s not going to work.
Joan: No of course not if it wasn’t God I mean this is ridiculous but it was God’s plan. My husband had no idea what I was doing and he’s going “Honey, Honey.” I’m not even listening to him. The man with the Porsche that’s handing him cash he’s going “Who do you think you are I am buying this property?” And I said “No you’re not we are it’s going to be for terminal or seriously ill children and it’s going to called God’s Little Acres and miracles are going to happen here and so you might as well leave.” And now I had put all of my jewelry into the owners hand and he’s standing with his hands cupped he had all of my jewelry and the guy doesn’t know what he’s doing and the owner turns around to the other man and says “You might as well leave and come back tomorrow because she was here first.” I was the 43rd person in less than a week that came to buy this property because it’s very valuable property for developers everyone of them were cash buyers of $400,000. I came and said we had no money we come in the name of the Lord. So he told the man to leave and he left, the man is holding my jewelry my husband really wanted to kick me. And I just kept moving away from him and he’s going Joan what are you doing what are you doing? And I said “I don’t know but we’re buying this property. He said “Joan what are you crazy?” We don’t have any money we got a $500,000 house over there and we’re making those payments but we don’t have any money to buy anything else. I said “Bobby God is telling me this property is His property and it’s going to be called ‘God’s Little Acres’ and miracles are going to happen here.” And he said “Joan what are you doing?” Now the owner he thinks we’re nuts but yet he went along with us. Later much later he told us we asked him “Why did you sell us this property when you had 42 cash buyers and us saying we have no money?” And he says you know it’s really amazing he said as you were saying that I was thinking I’m 75 years old, I’ve been a rich man all of my life, I have never done a thing to help anybody’s children.” He said when you said that this was going to be for sick kids I thought “My God I can maybe be a part of what they’re doing.”All the rich developers just want to tear the run down ranch down and build big beautiful homes. He said “But you wanted to keep the ranch and do something for kids and I thought I could be a part of it.”
Sid: You call this “God’s Little Acres” it’s for seriously ill children. Where did you get the title or the name?
Joan: God gave me it in one second coming up the driveway there was no plan, none this was not discussed and prayed about.
Sid: How were you handling all of this at that time?
Bob: I was in shock (Laughing.)
Bob: Not knowing what’s she’s doing because usually my wife and I always pray about everything. We’ll put it on the table and we’ll pray about it and we’ll come up with some ideas decisions should we do it shouldn’t we do it but this time it was totally totally not Joan. And you know now that I look back I can look at her I can still have a dream of like a vision of her and she was like in a trance because it was not Joan that was talking. And I kept looking at her and saying “What are you doing we didn’t even talk about this. I didn’t know you were going to do this.” You know I was in total shock. Now what really happened the owner said to us “Would you like to come inside?” And my wife said no we’re going to buy the house anyway you know the property anyway. So he said “Why don’t you come on inside and look around.
Sid: Joan you’re a real estate woman how come you’re acting so ridiculous?
Joan: Trust me and I used to be considered a pretty smart real estate women but this day I didn’t fit into the world system whatsoever not at all.
Sid: Okay times gone by 1000’s of children have come to God’s little Acres but tell me about that one little girl who had Down’s Syndrome and a heart condition and a heart condition and a pace maker. What did she yell to her momma?
Bob: Little Kathy.
Bob: Little Kathy…we just got finished with a function here and Little Kathy is such a sweet heart she just steals your heart from you she’s wonderful. She’s got a pacemaker, and she falls on the ground and she dies and her mother has to resuscitator. She has to walk around her with oxygen and so on. And so everybody else is leaving and she’s about the last family to leave and I went over to the mother and I said “Doe” that was her mother’s name Doe. I said “Doe would you mind if I prayed over Kathy and she said “No nobody’s every offered to do that.” And so I just took Kathy in my arms and I just prayed and I said “Father she was yours daughter before she was Doe’s touch her little heart and give her a new heart.” Because they had just put a pacemaker in, I said “Fix her blood disease Father, Lord You created this body you can fix it.” And it was a short prayer like that but you know I just meant it like I just knew that I just had to lay my hands on that little girl. And the mother she welled up with tears and said “Thank you very much.” And we love you guys and we’ll see you again next week. So she’s walking down the driveway and that was the end of it. And I come up and I told Joan I prayed for Kathy and she said “Really” and I told her what happened. And she said “Wow.” Well the phone rang about an hour later and Joan you can tell it because you answered the phone.
Joan: Well Doe was on the other line and she said “Joan the most incredible thing happened after Bob prayed for Kathy and he walked back up the driveway we went down and got right underneath the archway of “God’s little Acres” and Little Kathy looked up and said “Momma momma look at all of the pretty angels.” And Kathy said…Doe the mother said to me “Joan I have never explained to my daughter what an angel looks like and every time she comes here she sees the angel.”
Sid: Not only do people see the angels they what do they tell you they feel when they come on this property?
Joan: Every single person, every single person I don’t care what religion what faith they have or they have no faith or they are an atheist of they’re an agnostic it doesn’t matter when they come on this property they either burst out in tears or they say what are they feeling here?
Bob: How about the Muslim doctors that we had from the hospital that came up when we first opened up. They come on this property there was 3 of them and they say “What do we feel here?” And we said “It’s the power of God that you feel.” And they did not want to leave this property. They were here until 6:00 at night they said they’ve never felt such peace.
Sid: My guest by way of telephone is Joan and Bob Nast and I’m speaking to them at their home and office at Coconut Creek Florida. And we found that in 1980 Bob was convicted of counterfeiting; they were counterfeiting his group for over 6 million dollars. He could have gotten up to 60 years in prison. He just happens to see on television Hal Lindsey just happened to come on the air and talking about his book “The Late Great Planet Earth” and how to be saved. And the whole family said a prayer with Hal. Now they didn’t really understand what they were doing but then they go to the hearing to find out how many years he’s going to get. And the judge that he’s affectionately called (the federal judge) the hanging judge. All of a sudden he looks at Bob and says “I’m giving you 6 months.” Well that was a miracle an absolute miracle. So he goes off to prison for 6 months. His wife the mean time everyone around her is dying, her husband is in prison and she just to get away from it all gets into drugs, they have contacts with crime syndicate with the counterfeiting. I mean her life is a mess her 14 year old daughter comes in and says “Mom I’m running away from home and you’ll never see me again if you do not go to church.” Well Joan says to her daughter “Look I’ll do anything I’ll go to AA I’ll go anywhere. I just have a Catholic background that’s not for me.” Well she went into that church what happened Joan?
Joan: Well the music was playing and every hair on the back of my neck started standing up. I had never experienced even that feeling. People were touching me and saying hello and everybody was so friendly. And all I can do is remember that as I looked into everybody eyes I saw a peace that I’ve never seen. And I almost hated these people so what are they so happy about life stinks life is miserable but they’re happy. So I said to the people that I’m with “I’m not singing, I’m not praying, I’m not doing anything that these people are doing.” And they said “Don’t just listen.” But when I heard the pastor start speaking he started speaking about Jesus like he just had a cup of coffee with Him. He said speaking about Jesus like He was just there over the church. And I’m going who is this guy that he met Jesus already? And I was kind of a wise guy and I just couldn’t comprehend his relationship with Jesus the way that he spoke about Him. So all through the service my hands started raising up and going down, raising up and raising up and I was fighting against it. Finally at the end he said “Is there anybody here that needs Jesus.” And I thought “Huh I’ve tried drugs everything money can buy why not give it a shot that was my attitude.” So I raised my hand and of course I was the only one there was a couple of hundred people there at that time. And I went forward and he said “Do you know that God loves you?” And I had never heard those words said directly to me and I thought “He does.” I just did not feel loved by anybody so He says “Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, that He was born of a Virgin Mary, that He suffered and died and was buried and that there is a Father, Son and a Holy Spirit.” I said “Of course I do I’m Catholic.” He said “You believe that He rose from the dead.” I said “Sure I don’t have a problem with any of that.” He said “Do you know that you can make it to heaven for eternity if you just ask God to forgive you of your sins?” And I said “Get out, get out!” And those were my words and he said “No true story.” And I said “What do I have to do?” He said “Just tell Him your sorry, just tell Him your sorry for your sins and you can have eternal life in heaven with the Father.” Well this sounded like magic, this sounded like news to my ears, this sounded like nothing I had ever heard and I started getting excited. I said “If I just pray that’s it.” He said “Say it and mean it from your heart and say it to God don’t say it to me.” I said “Okay,” and so he prayed with me and I said it to God.” And all of a sudden I felt arms around me, feeling the arms I did not know that it was the arms of Jesus I was feeling. And He delivered me from the spirit of fear instantly I was instantly delivered from cocaine and drugs and marijuana and every foul drug that I had been using. It left me in one instant and the desire in 21 years have never come back.
Sid: Now at the same time that this is going on that same moment Bob what was going on with you in prison?
Bob: Well I finally got situated in prison and you know all of the reality finally hit me and I was in my little bunk there and it was just night and it was about a quarter after nine. I just fell to my knees and I just felt so confused I just felt like I had just wrecked my life which I did do. And I fell on my knees and I said “God” I said… I used to go to Catholic School and I knew that there was a God and I believed in God only I never had a personal relationship with Him. And I fell on my knees I said “God and I started crying I said “You probably heard this a million times before from a jail house cell but I’m going to make a promise to you if you’ll protect my wife from committing suicide or getting hurt (because I thought this was going to happen.) I said “You just protect her if you just spare my children the embarrassment that I caused them for what I did Father.” I said “I would never do another wrong thing in my life again I will serve you for the rest of my life.” Well at that time I just started crying and I just lost it all and I remember I was just looking down and I remember it was a quarter after nine and God is so good because He had my wife in that church at a quarter after nine accepting Jesus as her personal Savior and He just turned our life around.
Sid: Speaking of a life turned around you’re a successful developer, your wife is successful in Real Estate you had a half million dollar home on intercostals waterway near Fort Lauderdale. You had a 31’ boat that slept 6 a lifestyle most folks would call successful, but all of this changed when a young boy 10 years old by the name of Brandon Smith came into your life. Tell me what happened?
Joan: Well we had been visiting hospitals in the area for many many years helping children praying with them making them laugh. And the more we spent time with them down at Joe DiMaggio Hospital in Hollywood, Florida we met this little boy Brandon who was dying of Leukemia. And the first thing that we experienced when we went into his room at night and saying hello to him was the mother and father and the depression upon them. And we said “Why don’t you two go for a cup of coffee and we’ll stay with Brandon.” And they would go for a walk and…
Sid: So Brandon was terminal leukemia?
Sid: Okay go ahead.
Joan: So our heart went out to the parents and one night the father grabbed my husband and he said “Bob what am I doing wrong, what have I done to cause this for my son to get this disease and is dying?” And Bob said “Walter, he said bad things happen to good people this is not your fault there’s a devil out there and cancers from the pit of hell it has nothing to do with what you’ve done wrong you can’t blame yourself.” And we tried to comfort them and pray with them and we spent about 6 months going back and forth to the hospital. And we realized that all of the other children in the other room there was so many single parents and we found out that 80% of the parents that get a child attacked with a disease especially terminal the money goes, the job goes the house goes and eventually the husband goes because he cannot take the pressure and he blames himself. So as we experienced this time after time again with these wonderful people and unfortunately little Bandon went home to be with the Lord which another time we’ll tell you about what happened to this child. But anyway we said “You know what maybe we will have a place where these families can get a total break from the hospital where they can come out and get away from chemotherapy and all of the environment and laugh for a day. And maybe we can have volunteers take the little children away from their parents all day long and the parent can go for a walk sit down and have coffee do whatever just to get a break for the day. And that’s when the idea I guess was birthed in our heart about having a ranch for seriously ill children.
Sid: You actually had an open vision about the ranch which is now called “God’s Little Acres” tell me about that.
Joan: Well one day we were looking through the Real Estate being a typical realtor and I saw almost 5½ acres in Coconut Creek with a barn a number of barns and a house for sale. And all of a sudden I said “Bob Hun we’ve got to go look at this ranch.” Well at that time we had just lost a tremendous amount of money in the stock market. Work was okay and our bills were being paid but we had absolutely no money in the bank, nothing. So he said “Why do you want to go look for that for we don’t have any money?” And I said “No, I don’t know why we have to go.” So being the wonderful husband of 39 years this week that he is he agreed to come look at it. We came out to Coconut Creek and as we entered the driveway coming up to the Ranch it was probably the ugliest place I’ve ever seen at first. There was…everything was broken and run down the house was yucky we say Pepto-Bismol pink there was no landscaping everything was over grown. There was old tractors laying around, there was potholes coming up the driveway. I mean the place was horrible, but yet as we started entering up the driveway all of a sudden it was God dropped a screen out of heaven and I heard first I heard little children laughing. And I heard music, and then I saw what was so ugly become beautiful with a long porch with rocking chairs on it and people were rocking babies. And as I looked to the left and right I saw little wagons being pulled by little horses and I saw hay wagons being driven around with little children laughing. And all of the sudden this name came to me. Now the driveway is not 100 miles long it’s only you know maybe a 100 – 300 feet I don’t know.
Joan: Is it? And then by the time we got up there my husband is saying to me Joan what are you doing what is happening? And I went “Shh shh” and I couldn’t tell him but God was there with me and the Spirit of the Lord was upon me. That said as before this had not happened but by the time this was up the driveway there was a man in a Porsche talking to an elderly man we found out that was the owner. And as we got out I didn’t say anything to my husband.
Sid: Ah oh Mishpochah we’re out of time.
SID: Hello. Sid Roth here with Bill Morford. And we’re finding out such amazing revelations about the roots of the Bible that were literally hijacked, the Jewish roots and the idioms, and the culture, and the power. For instance, I mean, there’s so many things I want to ask you about. But the order of the books, in the original order of the Jewish Scriptures it ends in Chronicles, not Malachi. What difference does it make as you read it when you go from Chronicles to Matthew?
BILL: There’s a flow that does not exist in the normal Christian book order. But when you go from Chronicles with its genialities and move into Matthew, starting out with the geniality of Jesus, there’s just a flow. It actually surprised me. I wasn’t looking for that, but it’s there.
SID: Now tell me about an interesting woman in the New Testament by the name of Phoebe. What did you find out about her?
BILL: She was a patroness, sat over others. My verse says, “I am introducing our sister Phoebe to you, since she is also a minister of the congregation in sainthood, so that you would welcome and the Lord is befitting the saints, and you would stand by her in whatever matters she would have need of you. For she has also become a patroness of many, even of me.” So that the ones that say that she was a servant—
SID: It’s a bad translation.
SID: So are you telling me she was Paul’s pastor in that instance, in effect?
BILL: That’s what it sounds like to me, doesn’t it?
SID: Tell me about that there’s amazing word in the Hebrew, “anuchi.”
BILL: Oh, that’s awesome because it means “I Am.”
SID: I Am that I Am.
BILL: Right. But Rabbi Ben Yehuda calls it the “I am of purpose. It’s because I Am who I Am, I ordain this to be done.” And God always has that, when He uses that word it means that’s a verse we have to really pay attention to. So every time He uses that, I use “I Am” in caps and in bold type so that you know that’s the anuchi speaking.
SID: I like the way you refer to it. It’s I Am with an attitude. Give me a verse and say it with the attitude God meant it.
BILL: Okay. Isaiah 43:11 is “I Am, I AM your only savior.” And this is one of three verses that use the anuchi twice, a double anuchi. One anuchi is really a superlative. I mean, this is awesome. God has ordained this. He’s determined this is what’s to be done. But when He uses a double, how can we put in English how strong that would be.
SID: Now tell me something about the most gentile, Christian thing I can think of as a Jewish person that doesn’t know Jesus. Communion. It’s not very Jewish, is it?
BILL: [laugh] It’s entirely Jewish.
BILL: Well if you want to stay in the New Testament, you can. Luke 22 has Jesus at the Seder, and it records three instances, three blessings there. The first cup actually comes from Exodus 6:6, and it’s, “I will bring you out of Egypt.” And Jesus lifts that and says the blessing over the wine. Then he says the blessing over the bread. And with the bread that means you’re eating the meal, and with the meal they’re having a second cup of wine, and that cup, in Exodus 6:6, says, “I will rescue you from your bondage.” So that when we take the bread in our communion, we are actually celebrating his taking us out of our bondage. In other words, all deliverance has been done. It’s over.
SID: What’s that third cup?
BILL: And the third cup is amazing. Of course this is from Exodus 6:6, and it’s Jesus lifts that cup and he said, “This is the renewed covenant of my blood which is being shed for you.” And what Exodus 6:6 has for the third cup is it’s the cup of redemption. So this is the blood of our kinsman redeemer who has come.
SID: You can’t understand communion without understanding Passover, and it’s been hijacked from the church.
BILL: It has.
SID: It’s not so much that you’re being legalistic. It’s just that you’re understanding depth upon depth, upon depth. That’s with these biblical feasts God promises that He’ll show up. It’s an appointment with God. It’s so wonderful. Now I’ve always heard that Paul was a tentmaker. You say untrue. What was Paul?
BILL: He made prayer shawls.
SID: Prayer shawls?
BILL: Prayer shawls. Because there are other Greek words used for tentmakers, two of them. One for making the small pup tent that a traveler might carry, and one for the huge tents like the Bedouin live in.
SID: I’m so glad for so many revelations I’ve learned from Bill Morford. So I’m going to bless you with the revelation he shared with me about the Aaronic Benediction. The Lord WILL bless you. I tell you, the Lord WILL bless you. The Lord WILL keep you. The Lord will cause His countenance to come upon you and be gracious to you. The Lord will grant you his shalom, His completeness in your spirit, in your soul, and in your body in the name of Jesus the Messiah.